Tag: Rail Privatisation

  • PMQT – 31 January 1995

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 31st January 1995.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Sir Fergus Montgomery: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 31 January.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major): This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall have further meetings later today.

    Sir Fergus Montgomery: Has my right hon. Friend read the remarks by the chairman of Daimler-Benz in Germany, who has warned that he will move his firm out of Germany if the social chapter continues to pile costs on his business? Does not that show that my right hon. Friend’s stand in safeguarding the British opt-out is absolutely right and beneficial to British business? If Daimler-Benz decided to come to this country, would my right hon. Friend welcome it? May I suggest that there are many suitable sites in north-west England?

    The Prime Minister: I did see the remarks by the chairman of Daimler-Benz. I would, of course, be delighted to welcome Daimler-Benz to the United Kingdom, just as we welcomed Honda, Black and Decker, Samsung, Toyota and many others. My hon. Friend may not yet know that a survey today found that job prospects in Britain are better than in any other country in the European Union. Ironically, on this day of all days, socialist Members of the European Parliament, including Labour MEPs, have called for an end to our opt-out of the social chapter. I suggest that they speedily seek an audience with the chairman of Daimler-Benz.

    Mr. Blair: On rail privatisation, does the Prime Minister accept that it is a necessary consequence of setting a guaranteed level of service below the existing levels of service that private operators will have the right and the power to cut existing services, and that he will be powerless to stop it?

    The Prime Minister: I can tell the right hon. Gentleman that, this afternoon, the operators will make it clear that they do not intend to cut services. However, they do intend to exercise their freedom to increase services. Unless one is to sterilise the British rail system in its entirety, they need that flexibility. They will provide additional services and will say so this afternoon. If the right hon. Gentleman were serious about improving the service, he would not stand in the way of those reforms for his own ideological reasons but would join us in modernising a railway that can and will provide a better service for people in the future.

    Mr. Blair: First, on the point about additional routes that operators are seeking today, will the Prime Minister confirm that those who are making those bids today are wholly owned British Rail subsidiaries, and that that will not bind the private operators? Secondly, if he is so certain that they will keep or increase existing services, why not specify and guarantee that in their contracts?

    The Prime Minister: I made that point in terms of directing the improved services at the times and on the tracks that people want. The right hon. Gentleman might be reassured by what the chairman of Railtrack will also be saying today. He makes it clear that it is on the cards that the operators may want to increase their services still further and want additional track agreements with Railtrack to enable them to do so. It is becoming clear that those interested in running the service are interested, as are the Government, in improving the service and not leaving it in its present inadequate state.

    Mr. Blair: The right hon. Gentleman wants to improve the service, but is not it true that, under privatisation so far, some services have been cut, some are to be removed altogether, through ticketing is to be reduced and, today, he cannot even guarantee the existing level of service? In those circumstances is it any wonder that the public would prefer to keep British Rail as a public service, not break it up and sell it up to satisfy some faction in the Tory party?

    The Prime Minister: I know that the right hon. Gentleman wants to continue his political campaign against private ownership of British Rail. But he might make himself a little better informed about the existing situation before he begins to spread such scare stories. Under the present nationalised service arrangements, no service is protected–nor was it under any previous Labour Government–and never has been. The passenger service requirements to be unveiled today will, for the first time, underpin minimum contractual guarantees. The service provided will be in two components: the minimum guarantee to ensure that those services cannot be cut and the additional service that the private sector has already indicated that it will run in addition to the minimum guarantee. I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will now look at the reality and stop spreading scare stories.

    Mr. Sims: Can my right hon. Friend confirm that the responsibility for both the manner and pace at which the European Union develops lies with the Governments of the member states, individually and collectively, not with the Commission, which is the Union’s servant, not its master?

    The Prime Minister: Yes, I can confirm that to my hon. Friend. I think that there will be a number of members of the European Union at the forthcoming intergovernmental conference who will wish to ensure that the primacy of the European Council itself is enshrined and improved. I do not believe that the United Kingdom will be alone in seeking those particular changes. We all wish to see the European Union develop in a satisfactory way that is compatible with the interests of the people and the nation states across Europe. We have a number of positive proposals to make to that end, and we shall set them out in the weeks ahead.

     

    Q2. Mr. Tom Clarke: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 31 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Clarke: Given that the American Congress and Senate have accepted that there is evidence to confirm the existence of Gulf war syndrome and given that 421 former British service personnel have been identified as suffering in a similar way, does the Prime Minister agree that there is an urgent need for an inquiry? Does he accept that, as those people were willing to give their lives when he asked them, he has a moral responsibility to ensure that such an inquiry takes place?

    The Prime Minister: As the hon. Gentleman may know, the Medical Research Council has thus far found no evidence of Gulf war syndrome. We have told people who believe that they are suffering from any ailment as a result of the Gulf war to come forward and be examined so that we may determine the position for ourselves. I believe that the hon. Gentleman is wrong in the way that he refers to the American Government. I do not believe that they have made the statement that he attributes to them.

     

    Q3. Mr. John Marshall: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 31 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Marshall: Is my right hon. Friend aware that Hendon school in my constituency was the first school in London to become a grant-maintained school? Since then, it has been transformed and is now heavily oversubscribed. Will my right hon. Friend welcome the increased popularity of grant-maintained schools, particularly among the Opposition? Does he agree that it is disgraceful double standards for those who seek to deny others the freedom of choice to then exercise it themselves?

    The Prime Minister: I think that we all look forward to the day when the Opposition preach what they practise–it is self-evident that that has not been the case with education in the past. Of course, all parents want what is best for their children, and they are right to do so. We wish to ensure that the freedoms which are exercised quite correctly by Opposition Members in the interests of their own children are not denied to other people by Opposition policies.

    Mr. Ashdown: Given that the Prime Minister has already said, quite rightly, that education is the key to the country’s success, how does he justify cutting –[Interruption.]

    Madam Speaker: Order. Just a moment, Mr. Ashdown. Order. I call Mr. Ashdown.

    Mr. Ashdown: Given that education is the key to the country’s future, how does the Prime Minister justify cutting the allocation for education to local education authorities by a sum equivalent to £50 less for every primary school pupil and £200 less for every secondary school pupil in the land?

    The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman knows what the funding increases have been over recent years. I also give the right hon. Gentleman credit for appreciating that, quite apart from the increased resources that have gone into education in recent years, we have improved the quality and standard of education significantly through our reform of the curriculum; the opportunity that we have provided to schools to become grant maintained; the opportunity for testing children and for parents to know what that testing is; and through the publication of the performance tables, which ensures that there is peer pressure on bad schools.

    It would be more gracious for the right hon. Gentleman, who claims to be concerned about education–and I am sure that he is–to acknowledge those reforms which are now accepted in practice even by the official Opposition.

     

    Q4. Mr. Pawsey: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 31 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Pawsey: Can my right hon. Friend confirm that he has no plans to abolish grammar schools, grant-maintained schools, city technology colleges, the assisted places scheme or the charitable status of independent schools? Can he further confirm that he has no plans to introduce a graduate tax? All of those ideas are being actively promoted by Opposition Members.

    The Prime Minister: I am certainly pleased to confirm that to my hon. Friend. In recent years we have set out a series of education reforms which have now been accepted by the trade unions and teachers and welcomed by parents and many others. I believe that we can now look forward to a period of improvement and stability in education. The changes proposed by the Labour party will recreate unnecessary chaos. We have stability in education and we must retain it. We do not want the denial of choice that is proposed by the official Opposition.

    Mr. Shore: In view of M. Santer’s speech at Davos last weekend calling for early progress toward a single European currency and for reducing the voting power of the larger member states, does not the Prime Minister agree that, far from being the right man in the right place at the right time, he is in fact the wrong man in the wrong place at the wrong time?

    The Prime Minister: It would be extremely difficult to find a Commission President candidate who, on those two points, would not take the same position as the present President. If the right hon. Gentleman cares to plough through the rest of the Commission President’s speech perhaps he will welcome the fact that the President said that many people perceive a

    “bureaucratic, byzantine, technocratic Brussels maze.”

    The right hon. Gentleman will no doubt agree with that. The President also gave top priority to tackling Europe’s declining competitiveness, completing the single market in telecommunications and energy, ensuring the proper performance of single market rules, free trade and a strong common foreign security policy. Each and every one of those are British priorities in the European Union and they have been endorsed by the President of the Commission.

     

    Q5. Mr. Bellingham: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 31 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Bellingham: Will my right hon. Friend find time this afternoon to have a word with Department of Social Security Ministers? They will tell him that since last August, 10,500 non-British residents have been refused income support. That is a great saving to the DSS, despite opposition from Labour and the Social Affairs Commissioner. Does not that vindicate Government policy of concentrating benefits on people who need them most, in stark contrast to Labour which, in respect of benefits, is prepared to turn a blind eye to fraud and abuse?

    The Prime Minister: I entirely agree about the nature of changes introduced by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Social Security. I do not believe that any British taxpayer is happy subsidising people who have no close ties with the United Kingdom but who have been receiving benefit payments without having made contributions. The changes we made bring the United Kingdom more in line with our European partners, whose safety-net benefits are not normally available to our nationals freshly arrived in their countries.

    Mrs. Jane Kennedy: Is the Prime Minister aware that as the result of the botched introduction of reduced junior doctors’ hours, the accident and emergency unit at Broadgreen hospital in my constituency is being forced to close its doors sooner than planned? Does the right hon. Gentleman accept that that means patients presenting themselves for emergency treatment will suffer greater anxiety and pain, and that doctors and nurses will face greater stress? Will the Prime Minister accept that nothing less than the resignation of the Secretary of State for Health will satisfy the people whom I represent?

    The Prime Minister: I think that even the hon. Lady’s hon. Friends felt that she did not get the last part of her question right. I will not take lectures on health from the hon. Lady. As she is clearly aiming at what is happening in the health service, perhaps she will say whether she agrees with statements by Labour’s official health spokesman and other Labour Members as to the level of health spending. There are substantial differences. The Labour party is utterly split on that issue, as on so many others. One day, the hon. Lady and her hon. Friends will concentrate on the remarkable improvements achieved by people in the national health service, not carp and criticise week after week after week, and seek to undermine the service.

  • PMQT – 17 January 1995

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 17th January 1995.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mr. Winnick: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 17 January.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major): This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mr. Winnick: Why has the Prime Minister refused to allow the Nolan committee to look into the way in which political parties are funded? Is it because that committee would soon discover the underhand and shabby way in which the Tory party collects a lot of its money and how knighthoods and peerages are given to many of those who make the largest donations to the Tory party? Surely it is disgraceful that the Conservative party should carry on in that manner in this day and age.

    The Prime Minister: There is a disgrace in party funding. The hon. Gentleman is right–yes, indeed. The disgrace in party funding is the Labour party’s dependence on trade unions, which buy direct influence over that party’s votes. We have seen that many times in the past and we shall see it again with clause IV, as the old, unreconstructed Labour party comes to the rescue of the new Labour party.

    Mr. Brooke: Does my right hon. Friend recall that after the country gave up paying danegeld the policy was resumed under King Ethelred the Unready?

    The Prime Minister: My right hon. Friend always adds a touch of erudition to these occasions. I suspect that he has in mind the precise point that I touched upon just a moment ago–he who pays the piper calls the tune, and we know who pays the Labour party.

    Mr. Blair: On 10 January, the Prime Minister said at Prime Minister’s Question Time that he was as committed to maintaining the existing through-ticketing service on British Rail as I was. Tomorrow the House will have a chance to vote on a motion opposing any reduction in through ticketing. Will the Prime Minister therefore support that motion?

    The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman knows what the Rail Regulator said last week. The regulator made the position perfectly clear: he is now considering the responses to his own consultation document. He said:

    “Privatisation and restructuring of the railways are intended to improve service to customers and stimulate innovation. In looking at any new proposals to replace British Rail’s current arrangements, I shall want to be satisfied that they are likely to achieve those objectives.”

    I agree entirely and I shall wait to see what proposals the regulator makes.

    Mr. Blair: But the question is: what is the Prime Minister’s own position? The Secretary of State for Transport said that any reduction in existing through-ticketing services was unacceptable. Will that therefore be the Government’s position in the consultation, which the regulator has said may mean a significant reduction in service? Will the Government tell the regulator that that would be unacceptable? And if the regulator ignores the Prime Minister’s view, what will the right hon. Gentleman do?

    The Prime Minister: I set out the Government’s position precisely, just a moment ago. If the right hon. Gentleman had listened to my first answer, he might not have asked his second question. If the right hon. Gentleman were, time after time, to hear the Government say precisely what would be the outcome of consultations before the consultation was completed, and when the consultation was being undertaken by a regulator, he would accuse us of abusing the position of the regulator and not listening to the consultation.

    I repeat for the right hon. Gentleman: I shall want to be satisfied that the outcome of the consultation generally improves the service that is available to people on through ticketing and other matters. That is the purpose of privatisation. I am not satisfied at present with the service that British Rail has offered for many years, and I intend to see it improved. That is what privatisation will achieve.

    Mr. Blair: Is it not the case, therefore, that last week the Prime Minister was saying that he was committed to maintaining the existing service and that now he will not say that he is committed to doing so? [Interruption.] He has just been given two chances to do so, and he has not said it.

    Is not this the problem with privatisation? When the public see £700 million being spent up to now on privatisation, cuts in timetable, cuts in services, and now a possible cut in through ticketing, is it any wonder that they do not want British Rail broken up and sold off but want it maintained as a publicly owned, publicly accountable transport service?

    The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman has an unsuspected sense of humour. I had not imagined, after the turn and turn about in his transport policy on British Rail in the past few days, that he would have had the brass neck to suggest to us, incorrectly, that we had changed the position that we have taken on through ticketing. Our position is precisely as we stated it at the beginning. We have made it perfectly clear what we expect at the end of the process. Unlike the right hon. Gentleman, we have not changed our policy on Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday, as he has done through a range of his own spokesmen on the Front Bench, past and present, and his press spokesman.

    Mr. Hicks: In view of the disappointing performances by our English test cricketers in recent years and the contribution that cricket makes to our national society, does my right hon. Friend agree that there is an urgent need to establish a cricket academy in this country and that it is a suitable project for consideration for funding by the Millennium Commission?

    The Prime Minister: On the latter point, there is no reason why, if a suitable project were put forward, it could not be considered by the Millennium Commission or, indeed, I would think, in terms of the resources from the national lottery, by the Sports Council. As regards the general proposition, my hon. Friend knows my concern about team sports generally and my desire that they should be given much more importance in the school curriculum. We intend to pursue that.

     

    Q2. Mr. Darling: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 17 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Darling: The Prime Minister will recall his great triumph last year when he installed Monsieur Santer as President of the European Commission. In the light of what Mr. Santer had to say today on the subject of European integration, does the Prime Minister still believe that Monsieur Santer is the right man for the right job at the right time, or is the right hon. Gentleman guilty of yet another gross error of judgement?

    The Prime Minister: I wonder whether the hon. Gentleman has read all 34 pages of Mr. Santer’s speech. [Interruption.] It is obvious from the hon. Gentleman’s face that he has read the Press Association extract and nothing more. As for the best men for the job, we shall judge the new Commission by its performance and by its efficiency in carrying out the tasks assigned to it. As I have said before and I repeat now, I believe that the high tide of federalism in Europe is past, and I believe that that will be apparent in the forthcoming intergovernmental conference.

    Mr. Marland: Is my right hon. Friend aware that in 1974 the Conservative Government banned the export of live animals for slaughter but the Labour Government of 1975 lifted the ban? How does my right hon. Friend think that that squares with the squawking that we hear from Opposition Members, given that the Opposition agriculture spokesman was a member of the Government who lifted that ban?

    The Prime Minister: The straight answer to my hon. Friend is that I was not aware of the duplicity of the Opposition’s position on that subject –although I suppose that in view of their position on so many other matters, I would have been wise to look back and see what their agriculture spokesman had done in the past. Surely the right approach for all people concerned about the welfare of animals is to raise standards of animal welfare across the European Union, which is what we are seeking to do. We lead from the front in negotiations on the subject and we intend to continue to do so to seek the best standards of animal welfare, not just in the United Kingdom where they are already better than anywhere else in the European Union, but right across the European Union.

     

    Q3. Mr. Chidgey: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 17 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Chidgey: Is the Prime Minister aware that a recent survey by Eagle Star showed that there were more burglaries committed in Britain than in any other country in Europe? If so, will he now admit that the failure of his policies to tackle crime have placed this country not at the heart of Europe but on the far margins of lawlessness and disorder?

    The Prime Minister: I sometimes wonder whether there is any piece of silliness that the Liberal party will not adopt to make a party point. Everyone in the House is concerned to see crime cut. The crime statistics, for the first time in not just two or three years but 30 to 40 years, are now beginning to fall. I have seen no support from the hon. Gentleman or his colleagues on the Liberal Benches for the vast range of measures that we have taken in recent years to combat and punish crime. When the hon. Gentleman comes into the Lobby to support the fight against crime I will listen to what he has to say at Prime Minister’s Question Time on the subject of crime.

     

    Q4. Mr. Bellingham: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 17 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Bellingham: Will my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister find time today to consider West Midlands Travel which, under Labour, was a sleepy nationalised industry but which, under the Tories, has been a privatised success story and is about to be floated on the stock market? Is it not good news that all the employees will receive free shares and the directors, who include the former Labour transport spokesman, the hon. Member for West Bromwich, East (Mr. Snape), will make large profits on their share options?

    The Prime Minister: I suppose that that is another indication this week that it is best to be a former Labour transport spokesman than a current Labour transport spokesman. I welcome the flotation; I hope that it is a great success and that the hon. Member for West Bromwich, East (Mr. Snape) does well out of it. The privatisation of the bus services has proved immensely successful for bus service users and will continue to do so– [Interruption.] Labour Members who shout “Rubbish” had better take up the matter with the hon. Member for West Bromwich, East.

    Mr. Barnes: Why are the Government involved in a massive exercise to kill off the Civil Rights (Disabled Persons) Bill by introducing their own limited and restricted measure in the House ahead of discussions on that measure? The provision is required by the 10 per cent. of people in this country who suffer from disabilities and has massive support inside and outside the House.

    The Prime Minister: I suggest that the hon. Gentleman reads the Bill that he is seeking to dismiss. That “limited” Bill carries rights for disabled people when they are unfairly discriminated against in employment. It gives them the right to complain to an industrial tribunal when they feel that unlawful discrimination has occurred. It requires those providing goods and services to ensure that they are accessible and it provides for a conciliation service, a national disability council and measures to combat discrimination in transport and education sectors. If the hon. Gentleman thinks that that is a limited Bill, I think that he has limited capacity to understand what is in the Government’s legislation.

     

    Q5. Sir Peter Tapsell: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 17 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Sir Peter Tapsell: Is my right hon. Friend aware how greatly he heartened most people in this country when he stated on television on 8 January that at the intergovernmental conference in 1996 he would not agree to any constitutional change which impacted on the sovereignty of this Parliament? Does that not contrast–with striking historical force–with the renewed admission by the Leader of the Opposition in Brussels on 10 January that a Labour Government would agree to further reductions in British parliamentary and national sovereignty?

    The Prime Minister: I repeat that I believe that it would be a departure to make further constitutional changes. I was quite clear about that in my policy when I set it out a week or so ago. I am rather surprised by what the Leader of the Opposition had to say about handing more powers to the European Parliament in view of the low opinion that he expressed recently of some Members of that Parliament.

  • Mr Major’s Downing Street Press Conference – 16 January 1995

    Below is the transcript of Mr Major’s press conference, held at Downing Street in London on Monday 16th January 1995.


    PRIME MINISTER:

    Thank you all for coming this afternoon. I thought as we have now got into the New Year that it might be appropriate to take this opportunity to have a look across the political scene as it is at the moment.

    I think we are about to enter a particularly interesting phase, and let me firstly say something about the longer term. In around two years, maybe a little more, perhaps a little less, we are going to have to persuade the public once again to entrust us with government. After 17 years I do not believe that anyone should be complacent about that task. No party has a divine right to govern and no-one should expect a bouncy economy alone to ensure an election success.

    Last week I took some steps to put this country on course for the longer term. On Friday, with some senior colleagues at Chequers, I conducted a comprehensive review of Britain’s role in the world. We analysed both the risks and the opportunities in the immediate future. We looked at what we had to do to promote Britain’s national interest and we looked at the policies that we believe were right for Britain.

    A nation like ours, dependent for about one-third of its wealth on overseas trade, must promote its interests worldwide. We have for long been a global power and we will continue to be a global power, but in an increasingly competitive world, that means that we must single-mindedly pursue our interests around the world politically and commercially, we must all put Britain first.

    I plan to have further Chequers meetings to look at domestic and social policies – jobs, health, education, public services – and these will be critical in building up the government’s policies for the future. This is work similar to that undertaken before the 1992 election, but it will be much wider and with a much longer perspective.

    I have invited Secretaries of State to assemble policy groups, each in their respective areas, and the remit for these groups is to think both boldly and imaginatively. I want their prescriptions informed by a very wide process of consultation, with people in all walks of life, inside and outside the Conservative Party. The Policy Unit will also consult widely, external expert opinions will be sought, I intend to have the widest possible debate to build the next phase of Conservatism, to plan new policies for government in the new millennium.

    Over recent years I believe we have done what is right for this country. But I know that doing uncomfortable things, although often necessary in government, does not at the same time necessarily endear you to people. But if your policy is right, and you stick to that policy, the benefits do come through, and that is what I believe is now beginning to happen.

    The economic debate and the European debate have dominated politics for some time, the economy is now coming right, and I can now see a road to unity on European policy as we prepare for the Intergovernmental Conference in 1996 and 1997.

    But there is a political life apart from these two subjects. Jobs, education, health, personal choice and opportunity, the levels of tax, the quality of life in the public services, these are things that concern families in every part of the country. On the economy we have a broadly based recovery unlike any that we have seen since 1945. It is a recovery for the long term, it is not a flash in the pan, it is not fuelled by monopoly money. We are seeing confidence and growth restored to manufacturing industry, Britain is making things once more, as it traditionally did, and it is selling them to every corner of the world. People will feel the effects of this recovery only gradually, but as they do begin to feel those effects, they can have confidence that that recovery is going to last.

    We will continue to pursue privatisation for the best of reasons, to help improve the standards of service to the public. Frankly, I am not content with the service we have had over many years from British Rail, I want to remove British Rail for good from the stand-up comedian’s joke book and to turn them into the envy of the world, we did that with British Airways and I have every intention of doing that with British Rail as well.

    On education policy we are pursuing higher standards, more choice, more opportunity. Later this year we will come forward with our detailed proposals on nursery education, testing the National Curriculum performance tables, all of these are now beginning to lever up standards and people can begin to see that that is what is happening, the improvement is evident and we intend it to continue into the future.

    I am utterly committed to the National Health Service. Each year doctors and nurses care for more patients, a million more than since our reforms began. This year we are abolishing a complete layer of bureaucracy in order to target resources on patient care. The great reforms of recent years are in place and they are now settling down. It would frankly be folly to seek to tear up those reforms, it would introduce chaos and instability into General Practioners’ surgeries and into hospitals up and down the country. The result of that could only be to shift the focus away from the patient and better treatment for the patient.

    We will carry forward the sea-change in our approach to fighting crime. People want to know that crime does not pay, but that criminals do. The new measures which come into effect this year to come down hard on persistent young offenders and bail-bandits, for example, they will give the police more powers to put criminals behind bars and to make punishment fit the crime.

    Crucial to these reforms has been the operation of the Citizen’s Charter. The Charter has delivered better information and standards in both health and education and will do so right across government. It is, as it always has been, a ten year programme to improve public services. I do not believe that public services should provide a brusque response to the public or to be needlessly anonymous, they are there to serve the public, and to be accountable to the public, and that is the right sort of devolution.

    The consistent theme in these reforms is moving the decision-making process away from government and out to local people, that is the sort of devolution that I passionately favour, not devolution which creates extra tiers of bureaucracy with extra tiers of expense and extra tiers of frustration for most of the people in this country.

    We are opening up government steadily but significantly. The last two years have seen changes to our security and intelligence services, to the information available about government committees and departments. There have been changes following the Jopling recommendations in the way Parliament works; changes for the system of awarding honours; and changes to the decision-making process in Scotland. The British constitution is not a written constitution, but neither is it an unchanging constitution. But it should be changed only with care and with good reason, not in a careless fashion for political reasons. Above all, I am concerned to widen opportunity for everyone, whatever their start in life may have been. We want to help people meet their own ambitions and control more of their own lives.

    We have a crowded agenda in the years immediately ahead of us, but what we are also seeking to do is to fashion flow in a wider way than has been done for very many years, the direction of policy beyond the immediate future, and that work will start immediately.

     

    QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS:

    QUESTION (John Sergeant, BBC):

    Prime Minister, this has many of the characteristics of a press conference at the beginning of an election campaign, is it your intention to use this conference to mount an attack on the Labour Party, and Mr Blair particularly?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    What a tempter you are. The purpose of this press conference was to set out what I have just said to you, firstly, and secondly to honour the promise that I made to you, not necessarily you, John, but the Lobby and others generally in the summer, when I promised that from time to time I would have further press conferences so that you would have the opportunity to question me. If you wish to question me about the Labour Party, of course I will respond to the policy muddles that they are getting into on education, on British Rail, on devolution, on energy policy, on health and on a range of other subjects, but as you will notice, I did not myself introduce the subject.

    QUESTION (Peter Riddell, Times):

    You mentioned at the end of your statement about the constitution being changed with care, have you got any proposals yourself, particularly in relation to the Nolan Committee, will you be putting forward suggestions for improving say appointments to quangos and other matters being covered by Nolan?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I will be very interested to see what Nolan has to say. I think Nolan touches an area of concern that has been there for some time, and I think the Nolan recommendations will have to be looked at very seriously. I have not been invited to give evidence to Nolan, other members of the government will and where appropriate they will put forward particular ideas. But certainly we will wish to look very carefully at what Nolan recommends and very probably we will be seeking to implement much of it.

    QUESTION (Peter Snow, Newsnight);

    When you said in your New Year interview that at the Intergovernmental Conference on Europe next year you would not accept constitutional changes that would be damaging, did you mean by that that you would veto them or that Britain would not accept but the others could go ahead without you?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    The agreements at the Intergovernmental Conference have to be agreed unanimously, that is the way in which the European Union works. I am not in the business of just going there with heavy boots to be difficult, but if people propose constitutional change that I think is inappropriate for Europe, or inappropriate for the United Kingdom, then I will not accept it, I have made that perfectly clear.

    QUESTION (Peter Snow):

    You will veto it?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    If you choose to use that word, yes most certainly I will veto it, I will not accept it. If I do not believe it is in the interests of the United Kingdom, or indeed in the interests of the wider European case, then I will most emphatically say so and I will most emphatically say ‘No’. But I also said in that interview that I do not myself believe that the 1996 conference is going to raise huge constitutional issues, I cannot be certain about that, I cannot be certain what the other 14 countries will introduce, any country can introduce any issue it wishes, but I do not at the moment expect great constitutional issues to be introduced, if they are I believe the time is inappropriate, if they are and I think they are significant and damaging then I will reject them.

    QUESTION (Elinor Goodman):

    Given that you say this press conference is in part to map out the future of Conservatism, and also you admit to give us the chance to ask questions about the Labour Party, is Downing Street the right place to have it or shouldn’t it be at Conservative Central Office?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    You are the first journalist I have ever known not to wish to take the opportunity of asking questions wherever they may be asked, Elinor. But as far as the direct point you make is concerned, I am mapping out the policies for the rest of this government and for future Conservative governments.

    QUESTION (Michael Brunson, ITN):

    Can I ask about rail privatisation. I know that you always say that every privatisation is unpopular, but would you not accept that this privatisation seems to be unusually unpopular, even among some members of your own party? And secondly, since at least the Labour Party is now prepared to say that they are committed to a publicly owned and a publicly accountable railway after the next election, would you not accept that that is going to give those who may wish to buy, particularly Railtrack, very considerable anxiety about getting involved in this privatisation?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    You have brought me the news of what the Labour Party’s policy is at 1550 on Monday afternoon, whether it will be the same tomorrow morning I suppose is a moot point, it does seem to have undergone rather a few changes over the last few weeks. Last week Mr Blair was not sure whether he would renationalise or not. Mr Prescott equivocated in radio interviews, before that Mr Prescott was certain he would renationalise, and so would others. So I am not entirely sure what their policy will be in the future, though I strongly suspect that this is the first part of the Danegeld to be paid for the support that Mr Blair will seek on Clause 4.

    But as far as your direct question of concern, as to whether this is going to be uniquely unpopular, I would simply suggest that you go back and look at what was said in many of the previous privatisations. If, for example, I refer to British Steel, what was it that the Labour Front bench, Donald Dewar I think it was from memory said about British Steel – “totally irrelevant to the real interests of the industry and based on dogma”, he said, ‘the Labour Party is unequivocally implacably opposed to it.” British Steel, privatised, is now one of the most efficient steel-makers in the world. This was the privatisation that was said not to be concerned with the real interests of the industry. What was it they said about British Airways, again it was poor old Donald Dewar who was the Spokesman “British Airways will be the pantomime horse of capitalism, if it is anything at all” said the Labour Party about the privatisation of British Airways.

    I do not think there are many people here at this press conference or who may watch this answer who doubts that British Airways is now one of the most efficient airways anywhere in the world. So I believe it can be with British Rail, I am just not satisfied with what British Rail has produced by way of a service in the last 40 years or so, I believe it can do better, I know it is controversial but I believe it can provide a better service. And many of the scare stories that there have been about mass hackings of the line are dealt with in the legislation which ensures that services are protected. So I believe yes we can proceed with it, yes we will be able to proceed with the flotation, and yes over time precisely the same impact will be had by a privatised British Rail as we have seen with electricity, gas, steel, telecoms and British Airways, the private sector will run it better and passengers will get a better service.

    QUESTION (Mike Brunson):

    And they will buy it?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    And they will buy it.

    QUESTION (Adam Boulton, Sky TV):

    On the question of the Union, how do you reconcile your attitude towards Northern Ireland, in which you say Britain has no selfish strategic interest and you have given the people the right of self-determination, to your attitude to Scotland, and would you be prepared to consider another referendum on devolved government for Scotland?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    Well I was interested to see that the Labour Leader ruled out a referendum on legislation to introduce devolution to Scotland and Wales, I find that extraordinary if that is a settled position, but perhaps it will not be a settled position, perhaps it will change again. The distinction with Northern Ireland I think is very clear, in Northern Ireland we are not talking about a tax-raising assembly with the powers and authorities that would apparently be given to a Scottish Assembly. The danger with a Scottish Assembly, well there are many dangers with a Scottish Assembly, but I think there is a very real danger with that that it would firstly do dramatic damage to Scotland. And I say that with good reason. If Scotland is going to have the privilege of being more highly taxed, is Scotland going to have the degree of inward investment that previously it has had? I would suggest an inward investor would say: “But the Scots are more highly taxed, therefore there is going to be more pressure on wage demands, therefore my costs are going to be higher, therefore I am not going to invest in Scotland”. That is but one of a whole series of questions.

    The constitutional questions about what is proposed in Scotland are even more damaging. If Scotland is to have authority for education and health, and all health and education matters are to be settled by the Scottish Parliament, what rights would Scottish Members of Parliament have over those matters? None at all. What rights, therefore, should Scottish Members of Parliament have at Westminster over health and education in England, Wales and Northern Ireland? It is not credible. What in practise is being done in Scotland is that the Labour Party are well aware that they need a big majority of seats in Scotland in order to win a general election, they are very worried that the Scottish Nationalist Party would do very well in a general election, they are trying to out-bid the Scottish Nationalist Party in terms of winning seats, and they have now begun to realise the difficulties that that faces them. So they have offered an Assembly in Wales, but it seems a rather lesser Assembly, they do not regard that as important to Scotland.

    And then in order to square the circle they have said but we would have regional government all over England. There is no demand for regional government all over England, there is no demand for an extra tier of bureaucracy all over England. We are going to have, we are told by the Labour Party, a Premier for Scotland. Are we going to have a Premier for Wales? Are we going to have a Premier for Sunderland? Is his official residence going to be Roper Park? Who can tell? I could stretch to the corner of this room and back again the nonsenses that arise out of these devolution plans and the dangers that arise and I think those dangers are now becoming apparent, not just to the Conservative Party, but to Labour Members of Parliament in Scotland and in Wales and to people right across the country. They are just not thought through or thought out and they are immensely damaging.

    CHARLES RICE (EVENING STANDARD):

    Do you accept that if the Ulster Unionist MPs were to withdraw their support from the Government they could precipitate a general election a lot earlier than the two years you foreshadow and do you absolutely rule out paying Danegeld in any form to them?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I have made it perfectly clear all along that we propose to seek a settlement in Northern Ireland but that it can only be done by carrying with us the people of Northern Ireland. I have seen some of the concerns that have been aroused about what might be in the framework document which is the premise upon which I think you based your question. There is no question of joint authority with Dublin having authority over Northern Ireland; that was ruled out a long time ago and many of the concerns that have prompted stories over the last day or so are just out of date and wrong.

    PETER HAYES (CENTRAL TELEVISION):

    I work for an area in which you may recall you lost of one of your precious parliamentary seats fairly recently.

    PRIME MINISTER:

    All my parliamentary seats are precious, all of them!

    PETER HAYES:

    During the by-election campaign, one of your traditional supporters said to me that he accepted successes in Northern Ireland, he accepted success for example on the economy but he said: “What is new? What is the big idea taking us as Conservative supporters up to the next election?” What you you say to him?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think there a range of things if I may because this idea of one single, big idea is often a misleading proposition. Policy goes in a particular direction and the policy is going in the direction of moving as much authority and opportunity away from the centre and down to the individual and his family.

    The big idea is making sure that the people of this country have as much freedom, liberty and opportunity as they possibly can. That is the big idea that the Conservative Party has stood for for generations and stands for now. That is why we want the lowest possible level of taxation; that is why we have provided so much extra power and authority for self-governing schools and information for the parents in those schools; that is why we have taken the management of hospitals away from bureaucrats and put it actually down to National Health Service trust hospitals – 98% of hospitals are now trust hospitals.

    That is the drift and direction of policy; that is why we would much prefer to be cutting taxes rather than raising taxes, that is a matter of innate instinct for the Conservative Party, by instinct we cut taxes, we dislike raising them; we have had to do it, it has been damaging for us and I think as soon as we are able to reverse that prudently and safely on economic grounds we will do so.

    The idea that you seek for is to make sure that the individual, whatever fashion of life he may have, has the greatest amount of devolution of choice and authority to him or her; that is and always has been the big Conservative idea.

    TREVOR KAVANAGH (THE SUN):

    Prime Minister, in view of the recent disclosures both official and unofficial about the Royal Family, do you have any concerns about the standing and respect in which those members of the Royal Family are held?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I believe the Royal Family is a central glue in the constitution of the United Kingdom; I don’t see that changing. I know of everybody in public life in one form or another – it applies to the Royal Family, it applies to other people not just in elected public life – people expect very high standards all the time. think that has always been the position in this country.

    I think the underlying affection for the Royal Family remains immensely strong; I think that will manifest itself. From time to time, there are squalls which for a short term cause some difficulty; I think that is what they are, short-term squalls and the underlying affection, respect and admiration for the constitution of the monarchy itself will be untouched by this. I believe it will continue to endure and I personally believe it is immensely important for this country that it does.

    QUESTION (GMTV):

    Just a word about the people who have lost the whip. Do you accept that a couple of them may not actually wish to rejoin the Conservative Party despite the olive branches that you have proffered and what view do you take of that?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    It takes two to tango! The music has struck up, we will see who will take partners and when!

    QUESTION:

    Prime Minister, how soon do you anticipate you will be able to reassure those Unionists who suggested at the weekend that there might well be a general election this year and do you anticipate the search for a political settlement running into the next general election?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I can’t answer the second question; I don’t wish to put a time frame on the search for a settlement. I will go on searching for a settlement until we have a settlement because I believe that it is immensely important that we do so and I believe the prospects of a settlement exist.

    We will pursue the joint framework document. I think the fears that have given rise to stories, as I indicated a moment ago, are mistaken fears and I think it will become apparent that they are mistaken fears but if I may push aside the political element that you raise, I have said from the outset of this many times on the record – you will have heard me say it many times, I repeat it again – we will only be successful in bringing peace to Northern Ireland if we can carry with us all the people of Northern Ireland. That is why I am playing this with my hands open and the cards face-out on the table.

    Let me take the framework document since it has now been raised twice. When we have agreed the framework document with the Irish government, that isn’t something that is going to be imposed. The framework document will then be published for everyone to see; it is then for the constitutional parties to examine it, to consult it and to comment on it. It goes into the talks with all the constitutional parties; then, if they approve it, it goes to a referendum of all the people of Northern Ireland so the fear that there is some sort of deal in which joint authority is in some curious fashion going to be enforced over the people of Northern Ireland against their will is not going to happen and cannot happen. We have not got joint authority in the document, the document itself is for consultation; it will have to be approved by the political parties in Northern Ireland and when they have finished with it, it will have to be approved by all the people of Northern Ireland so they have a triple look on their own future and I believe that is the way to carry with this process all the people of Northern Ireland.

    There are ancient differences, feuds, fears that have been in Northern Ireland literally for generations; the only way to still them is for people to look carefully and cautiously at what is happening and decide for themselves that this is the right way to deliver peace.

    You asked whether we would have it by the general election. I can’t promise that. It is not necessarily a speedy process. I think it was – I hope it was – an Irish poet, Yates, who wrote: “Peace comes dropping slow!” and I believe that is right. I think it was the “Lake Isle of Innisfree” and if it wasn’t I will no doubt be told tomorrow! “Peace comes dropping slow.” I believe that is entirely appropriate to the way in which we are developing this question in Northern Ireland.

    Everybody – every sane and sensible person – wishes to see a permanent settlement in Northern Ireland. It cannot be done without patiently and carefully looking at each of the areas that need to be dealt with and trying to place in the right place on the chess-board all the pieces that will comfort the fears of the different groups and people of Northern Ireland. That is what we are trying to do and we will do it openly.

    JOHN CRAIG (DAILY EXPRESS):

    When you spoke to us in the sunshine back in the summer, you told us of your plans to reshuffle your Cabinet. Is the Cabinet you have got now the one that you would hope to lead into the next general election or can we expect some more changes between now and then?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    The next general election may be two-and-a-half years away but I certainly have no plans for changes now. I enjoyed that press conference in the garden; I did contemplate having it in the garden this afternoon but I wasn’t sure how generally popular that might be.

    QUESTION:

    [Inaudible] devolution for quite some time now, indeed since the last general election. Does it surprise you therefore to find in the opinion polls the majority swinging the other way, in the “Sunday Times” poll for example 49% for, 32% against?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think the debate on devolution is only just beginning. Why do I believe so many people favour it? I think instinctively in every part of the United Kingdom people are proud of being Scottish, Welsh, English or Northern Irish and instinctively asked about a Scottish Parliament “Would you like a Scottish Parliament?” I think the answer instinctively is likely to be yes. Asked: “Would you like to pay more income tax than anybody else in the vicinity?” the answer may be no. Asked whether you would wish to see companies disinvest, moving away from Scotland, creating more people unemployed, I think the answer would be no. Asked whether you want to be a little Scotland in the middle of a great European Community without having the negotiating strength of the whole United Kingdom, I think the answer would be no. Asked if you would like to be the United Kingdom equivalent of Quebec in Canada, I think the answer will be no.

    It is not only me, not only the Conservative Party who thinks that these plans are folly. Other people, as they begin to examine them, will see that underneath the general aspiration there are very dangerous and damaging policies indeed. I will spell them out in detail again if you wish but I think you all are aware of the things that concern me: the different taxation policy; the question of the rights of Members of Parliament at Westminster in Scotland; the fact that if there was a Scottish Parliament there would be no justification for the numerically over-large Scottish membership in the House of Commons.

    All those are issues of some importance but if a Scottish Parliament was established and then began to challenge the English Parliament on issues, as I believe would almost undoubtedly be the case over time, what are the difficulties that are going to arise at that stage? What happens if there is a backlash elsewhere in the United Kingdom against the Scottish Parliament? I am not speaking out against the wishes of Scotland, I believe I am speaking for the interests of Scotland in pointing out that what is proposed is not a proposition that will help the living standards of Scotland or the future of Scotland and I will continue to make that point until we have won the debate, won the argument and seen these damaging proposals ditched and gone for ever.

    ROBIN OAKLEY (BBC TV):

    Prime Minister, two of your biggest problems in running your party centre round the disunity on Europe and on the sleaze factor. Why have you moved from saying that the rebels have got to work their way back over months to saying they would be taken back within weeks? What strength will your whips have to exert any discipline in future if they are taken back quickly?

    On the sleaze factor, why are you not encouraging the Nolan Committee to look into the financing of political parties around which many people’s worries on the sleaze factor tend to concentrate?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I don’t think that is the remit of the Nolan Committee, it wasn’t set up to look at that and I don’t anticipate that it is going to look at that.

    On the first point, the question of the colleagues who don’t have the whip, it is up to events to determine when they come back. I indicated over the weekend that I thought on many issues they were very strong Conservatives indeed, they will wish to see a Conservative victory at the next general election. I don’t believe the issues of dispute that have caused this split are issues that it is impossible to resolve. I think some of the resolution is now in place and I think the rest of the resolution is now a clear path so I believe that they will come back. I can’t determine when they come back, it will need an agreement between both of us – as I indicated a moment ago, it takes two to reach such an agreement. I hope that they will decide to do so and I believe that is the wish of the 321 Conservative MPs in the House who have the whip.

    QUESTION (CH4):

    Prime Minister, could you foresee winning the next general election without lowering taxes substantially?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I can’t anticipate the next two budgets. I am in favour of lower taxes but only providing it is economically justifiable; we will have to wait and see whether that is the case. I don’t think it would be prudent for me to tell you now what will be in the next budget or indeed the budget after that.

    QUESTION (DON McINTYRE):

    Prime Minister, do you think that the current well-publicised deliberations of the CBI and others on executive pay are in the end going to result in some form of legislation on that topic?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think they are trying to produce a system where peer pressure works and I believe that is the right way to deal with it. I think peer pressure on executive pay and ensuring that shareholders and institutional shareholders perhaps in particular use their power as the owners of companies to ensure that top pay awards are satisfactory is right.

    The danger is, however ill-advised some of these very large pay increases may have been and however offensive they may have been to many people, once you get in the direction of determining pay for top executives, where do you stop? Do you stop just at the former nationalised industries? Do you look beyond that to other companies that one way or another serve the people? Do you actually look at football managers, editors of newspapers? Where do you stop? You are actually getting into a position where the Government is going to decide who is paid what in areas that are not owned by the Government. That has been tried in the past, it has never in the past been successful.

    I share the concern that many people felt about some of these pay increases and I don’t think anybody who knows me doubts that and I think most of you in this room know that very well but the question is in opposition you can play gesture politics, in government you can’t. In government, you would be asking us: “What are you going to do?” and when we had said: “We are going to do this!” you would have pointed out all the defects in that insofar as it affected other people and you would have been right to do so. Gesture politics is very effective if you are in opposition but it is not effective if your are a government and I think therefore that the tight way to deal with this is the way the CBI are doing, the establishment of the Greenbury Committee. The National Association Of Pension Funds and others have expressed similar views and that sort of peer pressure is the best way to get an effective answer in my judgement.

    QUESTION:

    Prime Minister, you said in your statement that you were going to seek advice from Conservative non-government groups in formulating your policies for the next century. Can you indicate what groups you have in mind and would you welcome members of the public writing in to tell you what they thought?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    They always have done in my recollection. Let me be clear. I certainly didn’t mean the Labour Party and the Liberal Party; I don’t think any advice from them would be likely to be productive. I had in mind people who are non-political, who are specialists in whatever it may be, transport, the environment. I anticipate utilising and inviting some of the specialists in areas of great importance to future Government policy to submit their views on what needs to be done and of course, if people have a particular interest or a particular knowledge we would wish to hear what their views are. We are not just looking at a manifesto for the next general election – let me emphasise that again – we are looking at a much wider and longer time-scale so that we can look at the next phase of development in the United Kingdom and the sort of policies that we think are appropriate both for Great Britain as a country internationally and also for individuals within great Britain and their own individual liberties, choices and opportunities.

    QUESTION:

    [Inaudible] a new strategic authority for Greater London?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    No, I have no plans to do so at the moment, no.

    QUESTION (RADIO COVERING THE NORTH-EAST):

    Could you offer a message of hope for the people in the North-East, particularly the unemployed who feel they have been betrayed by your Government?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think unemployment is falling pretty rapidly in many parts of the country, not least of course the North-East. You put the point rather provocatively but I think many of the people in the North-East would look at some of the very large external investments providing jobs in the North-East and they might say to themselves would those investments have come to the United Kingdom and in particular would they have come to the North-East if it hadn’t been for the policies that the Conservative Government had followed and the answer to that question, as you will, know, is no, they would not have come to the United Kingdom and they would not have come to the North-East so I believe when they look at that dispassionately they will see the opportunities for increasing employment.

    What we have seen over the past two years is a continuing reduction in the level of unemployment; it has come down, frankly, faster than we imagined that it would and it is very welcome that it has done so and I hope what we are going to see in the months ahead is a continuing fall in unemployment and to make the reverse point, a continuing rise of the number of people in employment as well. The economy is set fair for that; although there is not a direct relationship between growth and job creation for a number of complex reasons, I hope that is the trend that we are going to see.

    QUESTION (MICHAEL WHITE):

    You are holding this press conference 43.5% behind in the polls, you say the economic recovery is coming through but isn’t it possible that if people feel as confident as you say they will they will take a chance on another government and if they don’t the reason why you are 43.5% behind is that “Daily Telegraph” readers feel all the insecurity which skilled workers – Labour voters – felt ten years ago when your free-market revolution began? Boris’s readers are as nervous as everybody else.

    PRIME MINISTER:

    Is Boris here. Oh there he is!

    You quote Gallup; Mori had a rather different figure which just indicates how volatile the opinion polls are at the moment, I have never been a great advocate of opinion polls on the question of voting at a particular time and that has been true in days when they have been favour to the Conservative Party as well as days when they have been less favourable to the Conservative Party.

    I believe that one can begin to see a great sea change in what has been put in hand over the past three or four years. We put a whole range of things in hand; we have produced a great deal of reform. Reform is often painful, it upsets people, people tend to object very strongly if their particular profession is being reformed; they certainly object very strongly if they face increased taxation they didn’t expect so there are a range of issues why people have had reason to feel disenchanted but because of the decisions that we have taken, because we accepted the unpopularity that went with those decisions, we can now see in the second half of this Parliament – and we are only just entering the second half of this Parliament – that we are on the most secure growth pattern for the economy that we have known for very many years indeed, that the education policies are delivering higher standards, better results, more young people in further education and better information for parents; that the health reforms are producing many more people treated, a wider range of treatments and faster treatment than ever before; and that in a whole series of other Government policies we can see a distinct improvement coming through so I believe the attitude does change. There is a fashion about these things. I think people will begin to see over the months ahead that the circumstances are changed, that many people who feel gloomy will begin to feel perhaps the gloom has been overdone and the prospects for them are much better.

    One of the things I believe affecting many of the people who feel very concerned is insecurity about their own employment prospects – you referred to Boris’s readers, I am sure that would be the case with many of those people – and yet we have seen for two years unemployment falling. In France, the nearest comparable economy to the United Kingdom in size and structure, you have unemployment at 12.8% and rising; here in Britain it is 8.8% and falling. That argues that we must have done something right and I believe as that continues to fall that message is going to echo very clearly in each and every part of the country and I will do my best to ensure that it does, Michael, as I am sure you will.

  • Mr Major’s Downing Street Press Conference – 16 January 1995

    Below is the transcript of Mr Major’s press conference, held at Downing Street in London on Monday 16 January 1995.


    PRIME MINISTER:

    Thank you all for coming this afternoon. I thought as we have now got into the New Year that it might be appropriate to take this opportunity to have a look across the political scene as it is at the moment.

    I think we are about to enter a particularly interesting phase, and let me firstly say something about the longer term. In around two years, maybe a little more, perhaps a little less, we are going to have to persuade the public once again to entrust us with government. After 17 years I do not believe that anyone should be complacent about that task. No party has a divine right to govern and no-one should expect a bouncy economy alone to ensure an election success.

    Last week I took some steps to put this country on course for the longer term. On Friday, with some senior colleagues at Chequers, I conducted a comprehensive review of Britain’s role in the world. We analysed both the risks and the opportunities in the immediate future. We looked at what we had to do to promote Britain’s national interest and we looked at the policies that we believe were right for Britain.

    A nation like ours, dependent for about one-third of its wealth on overseas trade, must promote its interests worldwide. We have for long been a global power and we will continue to be a global power, but in an increasingly competitive world, that means that we must single-mindedly pursue our interests around the world politically and commercially, we must all put Britain first.

    I plan to have further Chequers meetings to look at domestic and social policies – jobs, health, education, public services – and these will be critical in building up the government’s policies for the future. This is work similar to that undertaken before the 1992 election, but it will be much wider and with a much longer perspective.

    I have invited Secretaries of State to assemble policy groups, each in their respective areas, and the remit for these groups is to think both boldly and imaginatively. I want their prescriptions informed by a very wide process of consultation, with people in all walks of life, inside and outside the Conservative Party. The Policy Unit will also consult widely, external expert opinions will be sought, I intend to have the widest possible debate to build the next phase of Conservatism, to plan new policies for government in the new millennium.

    Over recent years I believe we have done what is right for this country. But I know that doing uncomfortable things, although often necessary in government, does not at the same time necessarily endear you to people. But if your policy is right, and you stick to that policy, the benefits do come through, and that is what I believe is now beginning to happen.

    The economic debate and the European debate have dominated politics for some time, the economy is now coming right, and I can now see a road to unity on European policy as we prepare for the Intergovernmental Conference in 1996 and 1997.

    But there is a political life apart from these two subjects. Jobs, education, health, personal choice and opportunity, the levels of tax, the quality of life in the public services, these are things that concern families in every part of the country. On the economy we have a broadly based recovery unlike any that we have seen since 1945. It is a recovery for the long term, it is not a flash in the pan, it is not fuelled by monopoly money. We are seeing confidence and growth restored to manufacturing industry, Britain is making things once more, as it traditionally did, and it is selling them to every corner of the world. People will feel the effects of this recovery only gradually, but as they do begin to feel those effects, they can have confidence that that recovery is going to last.

    We will continue to pursue privatisation for the best of reasons, to help improve the standards of service to the public. Frankly, I am not content with the service we have had over many years from British Rail, I want to remove British Rail for good from the stand-up comedian’s joke book and to turn them into the envy of the world, we did that with British Airways and I have every intention of doing that with British Rail as well.

    On education policy we are pursuing higher standards, more choice, more opportunity. Later this year we will come forward with our detailed proposals on nursery education, testing the National Curriculum performance tables, all of these are now beginning to lever up standards and people can begin to see that that is what is happening, the improvement is evident and we intend it to continue into the future.

    I am utterly committed to the National Health Service. Each year doctors and nurses care for more patients, a million more than since our reforms began. This year we are abolishing a complete layer of bureaucracy in order to target resources on patient care. The great reforms of recent years are in place and they are now settling down. It would frankly be folly to seek to tear up those reforms, it would introduce chaos and instability into General Practioners’ surgeries and into hospitals up and down the country. The result of that could only be to shift the focus away from the patient and better treatment for the patient.

    We will carry forward the sea-change in our approach to fighting crime. People want to know that crime does not pay, but that criminals do. The new measures which come into effect this year to come down hard on persistent young offenders and bail-bandits, for example, they will give the police more powers to put criminals behind bars and to make punishment fit the crime.

    Crucial to these reforms has been the operation of the Citizen’s Charter. The Charter has delivered better information and standards in both health and education and will do so right across government. It is, as it always has been, a ten year programme to improve public services. I do not believe that public services should provide a brusque response to the public or to be needlessly anonymous, they are there to serve the public, and to be accountable to the public, and that is the right sort of devolution.

    The consistent theme in these reforms is moving the decision-making process away from government and out to local people, that is the sort of devolution that I passionately favour, not devolution which creates extra tiers of bureaucracy with extra tiers of expense and extra tiers of frustration for most of the people in this country.

    We are opening up government steadily but significantly. The last two years have seen changes to our security and intelligence services, to the information available about government committees and departments. There have been changes following the Jopling recommendations in the way Parliament works; changes for the system of awarding honours; and changes to the decision-making process in Scotland. The British constitution is not a written constitution, but neither is it an unchanging constitution. But it should be changed only with care and with good reason, not in a careless fashion for political reasons. Above all, I am concerned to widen opportunity for everyone, whatever their start in life may have been. We want to help people meet their own ambitions and control more of their own lives.

    We have a crowded agenda in the years immediately ahead of us, but what we are also seeking to do is to fashion flow in a wider way than has been done for very many years, the direction of policy beyond the immediate future, and that work will start immediately.

    QUESTIONS AND ANSWERS:

    QUESTION (John Sergeant, BBC):

    Prime Minister, this has many of the characteristics of a press conference at the beginning of an election campaign, is it your intention to use this conference to mount an attack on the Labour Party, and Mr Blair particularly?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    What a tempter you are. The purpose of this press conference was to set out what I have just said to you, firstly, and secondly to honour the promise that I made to you, not necessarily you, John, but the Lobby and others generally in the summer, when I promised that from time to time I would have further press conferences so that you would have the opportunity to question me. If you wish to question me about the Labour Party, of course I will respond to the policy muddles that they are getting into on education, on British Rail, on devolution, on energy policy, on health and on a range of other subjects, but as you will notice, I did not myself introduce the subject.

    QUESTION (Peter Riddell, Times):

    You mentioned at the end of your statement about the constitution being changed with care, have you got any proposals yourself, particularly in relation to the Nolan Committee, will you be putting forward suggestions for improving say appointments to quangos and other matters being covered by Nolan?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I will be very interested to see what Nolan has to say. I think Nolan touches an area of concern that has been there for some time, and I think the Nolan recommendations will have to be looked at very seriously. I have not been invited to give evidence to Nolan, other members of the government will and where appropriate they will put forward particular ideas. But certainly we will wish to look very carefully at what Nolan recommends and very probably we will be seeking to implement much of it.

    QUESTION (Peter Snow, Newsnight);

    When you said in your New Year interview that at the Intergovernmental Conference on Europe next year you would not accept constitutional changes that would be damaging, did you mean by that that you would veto them or that Britain would not accept but the others could go ahead without you?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    The agreements at the Intergovernmental Conference have to be agreed unanimously, that is the way in which the European Union works. I am not in the business of just going there with heavy boots to be difficult, but if people propose constitutional change that I think is inappropriate for Europe, or inappropriate for the United Kingdom, then I will not accept it, I have made that perfectly clear.

    QUESTION (Peter Snow):

    You will veto it?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    If you choose to use that word, yes most certainly I will veto it, I will not accept it. If I do not believe it is in the interests of the United Kingdom, or indeed in the interests of the wider European case, then I will most emphatically say so and I will most emphatically say ‘No’. But I also said in that interview that I do not myself believe that the 1996 conference is going to raise huge constitutional issues, I cannot be certain about that, I cannot be certain what the other 14 countries will introduce, any country can introduce any issue it wishes, but I do not at the moment expect great constitutional issues to be introduced, if they are I believe the time is inappropriate, if they are and I think they are significant and damaging then I will reject them.

    QUESTION (Elinor Goodman):

    Given that you say this press conference is in part to map out the future of Conservatism, and also you admit to give us the chance to ask questions about the Labour Party, is Downing Street the right place to have it or shouldn’t it be at Conservative Central Office?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    You are the first journalist I have ever known not to wish to take the opportunity of asking questions wherever they may be asked, Elinor. But as far as the direct point you make is concerned, I am mapping out the policies for the rest of this government and for future Conservative governments.

    QUESTION (Michael Brunson, ITN):

    Can I ask about rail privatisation. I know that you always say that every privatisation is unpopular, but would you not accept that this privatisation seems to be unusually unpopular, even among some members of your own party? And secondly, since at least the Labour Party is now prepared to say that they are committed to a publicly owned and a publicly accountable railway after the next election, would you not accept that that is going to give those who may wish to buy, particularly Railtrack, very considerable anxiety about getting involved in this privatisation?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    You have brought me the news of what the Labour Party’s policy is at 1550 on Monday afternoon, whether it will be the same tomorrow morning I suppose is a moot point, it does seem to have undergone rather a few changes over the last few weeks. Last week Mr Blair was not sure whether he would renationalise or not. Mr Prescott equivocated in radio interviews, before that Mr Prescott was certain he would renationalise, and so would others. So I am not entirely sure what their policy will be in the future, though I strongly suspect that this is the first part of the Danegeld to be paid for the support that Mr Blair will seek on Clause 4.

    But as far as your direct question of concern, as to whether this is going to be uniquely unpopular, I would simply suggest that you go back and look at what was said in many of the previous privatisations. If, for example, I refer to British Steel, what was it that the Labour Front bench, Donald Dewar I think it was from memory said about British Steel – “totally irrelevant to the real interests of the industry and based on dogma”, he said, ‘the Labour Party is unequivocally implacably opposed to it.” British Steel, privatised, is now one of the most efficient steel-makers in the world. This was the privatisation that was said not to be concerned with the real interests of the industry. What was it they said about British Airways, again it was poor old Donald Dewar who was the Spokesman “British Airways will be the pantomime horse of capitalism, if it is anything at all” said the Labour Party about the privatisation of British Airways.

    I do not think there are many people here at this press conference or who may watch this answer who doubts that British Airways is now one of the most efficient airways anywhere in the world. So I believe it can be with British Rail, I am just not satisfied with what British Rail has produced by way of a service in the last 40 years or so, I believe it can do better, I know it is controversial but I believe it can provide a better service. And many of the scare stories that there have been about mass hackings of the line are dealt with in the legislation which ensures that services are protected. So I believe yes we can proceed with it, yes we will be able to proceed with the flotation, and yes over time precisely the same impact will be had by a privatised British Rail as we have seen with electricity, gas, steel, telecoms and British Airways, the private sector will run it better and passengers will get a better service.

    QUESTION (Mike Brunson):

    And they will buy it?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    And they will buy it.

    QUESTION (Adam Boulton, Sky TV):

    On the question of the Union, how do you reconcile your attitude towards Northern Ireland, in which you say Britain has no selfish strategic interest and you have given the people the right of self-determination, to your attitude to Scotland, and would you be prepared to consider another referendum on devolved government for Scotland?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    Well I was interested to see that the Labour Leader ruled out a referendum on legislation to introduce devolution to Scotland and Wales, I find that extraordinary if that is a settled position, but perhaps it will not be a settled position, perhaps it will change again. The distinction with Northern Ireland I think is very clear, in Northern Ireland we are not talking about a tax-raising assembly with the powers and authorities that would apparently be given to a Scottish Assembly. The danger with a Scottish Assembly, well there are many dangers with a Scottish Assembly, but I think there is a very real danger with that that it would firstly do dramatic damage to Scotland. And I say that with good reason. If Scotland is going to have the privilege of being more highly taxed, is Scotland going to have the degree of inward investment that previously it has had? I would suggest an inward investor would say: “But the Scots are more highly taxed, therefore there is going to be more pressure on wage demands, therefore my costs are going to be higher, therefore I am not going to invest in Scotland”. That is but one of a whole series of questions.

    The constitutional questions about what is proposed in Scotland are even more damaging. If Scotland is to have authority for education and health, and all health and education matters are to be settled by the Scottish Parliament, what rights would Scottish Members of Parliament have over those matters? None at all. What rights, therefore, should Scottish Members of Parliament have at Westminster over health and education in England, Wales and Northern Ireland? It is not credible. What in practise is being done in Scotland is that the Labour Party are well aware that they need a big majority of seats in Scotland in order to win a general election, they are very worried that the Scottish Nationalist Party would do very well in a general election, they are trying to out-bid the Scottish Nationalist Party in terms of winning seats, and they have now begun to realise the difficulties that that faces them. So they have offered an Assembly in Wales, but it seems a rather lesser Assembly, they do not regard that as important to Scotland.

    And then in order to square the circle they have said but we would have regional government all over England. There is no demand for regional government all over England, there is no demand for an extra tier of bureaucracy all over England. We are going to have, we are told by the Labour Party, a Premier for Scotland. Are we going to have a Premier for Wales? Are we going to have a Premier for Sunderland? Is his official residence going to be Roper Park? Who can tell? I could stretch to the corner of this room and back again the nonsenses that arise out of these devolution plans and the dangers that arise and I think those dangers are now becoming apparent, not just to the Conservative Party, but to Labour Members of Parliament in Scotland and in Wales and to people right across the country. They are just not thought through or thought out and they are immensely damaging.

    CHARLES RICE (EVENING STANDARD):

    Do you accept that if the Ulster Unionist MPs were to withdraw their support from the Government they could precipitate a general election a lot earlier than the two years you foreshadow and do you absolutely rule out paying Danegeld in any form to them?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I have made it perfectly clear all along that we propose to seek a settlement in Northern Ireland but that it can only be done by carrying with us the people of Northern Ireland. I have seen some of the concerns that have been aroused about what might be in the framework document which is the premise upon which I think you based your question. There is no question of joint authority with Dublin having authority over Northern Ireland; that was ruled out a long time ago and many of the concerns that have prompted stories over the last day or so are just out of date and wrong.

    PETER HAYES (CENTRAL TELEVISION):

    I work for an area in which you may recall you lost of one of your precious parliamentary seats fairly recently.

    PRIME MINISTER:

    All my parliamentary seats are precious, all of them!

    PETER HAYES:

    During the by-election campaign, one of your traditional supporters said to me that he accepted successes in Northern Ireland, he accepted success for example on the economy but he said: “What is new? What is the big idea taking us as Conservative supporters up to the next election?” What you you say to him?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think there a range of things if I may because this idea of one single, big idea is often a misleading proposition. Policy goes in a particular direction and the policy is going in the direction of moving as much authority and opportunity away from the centre and down to the individual and his family.

    The big idea is making sure that the people of this country have as much freedom, liberty and opportunity as they possibly can. That is the big idea that the Conservative Party has stood for for generations and stands for now. That is why we want the lowest possible level of taxation; that is why we have provided so much extra power and authority for self-governing schools and information for the parents in those schools; that is why we have taken the management of hospitals away from bureaucrats and put it actually down to National Health Service trust hospitals –98% of hospitals are now trust hospitals.

    That is the drift and direction of policy; that is why we would much prefer to be cutting taxes rather than raising taxes, that is a matter of innate instinct for the Conservative Party, by instinct we cut taxes, we dislike raising them; we have had to do it, it has been damaging for us and I think as soon as we are able to reverse that prudently and safely on economic grounds we will do so.

    The idea that you seek for is to make sure that the individual, whatever fashion of life he may have, has the greatest amount of devolution of choice and authority to him or her; that is and always has been the big Conservative idea.

    TREVOR KAVANAGH (THE SUN):

    Prime Minister, in view of the recent disclosures both official and unofficial about the Royal Family, do you have any concerns about the standing and respect in which those members of the Royal Family are held?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I believe the Royal Family is a central glue in the constitution of the United Kingdom; I don’t see that changing. I know of everybody in public life in one form or another – it applies to the Royal Family, it applies to other people not just in elected public life – people expect very high standards all the time. think that has always been the position in this country.

    I think the underlying affection for the Royal Family remains immensely strong; I think that will manifest itself. From time to time, there are squalls which for a short term cause some difficulty; I think that is what they are, short-term squalls and the underlying affection, respect and admiration for the constitution of the monarchy itself will be untouched by this. I believe it will continue to endure and I personally believe it is immensely important for this country that it does.

    QUESTION (GMTV):

    Just a word about the people who have lost the whip. Do you accept that a couple of them may not actually wish to rejoin the Conservative Party despite the olive branches that you have proffered and what view do you take of that?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    It takes two to tango! The music has struck up, we will see who will take partners and when!

    QUESTION:

    Prime Minister, how soon do you anticipate you will be able to reassure those Unionists who suggested at the weekend that there might well be a general election this year and do you anticipate the search for a political settlement running into the next general election?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I can’t answer the second question; I don’t wish to put a time frame on the search for a settlement. I will go on searching for a settlement until we have a settlement because I believe that it is immensely important that we do so and I believe the prospects of a settlement exist.

    We will pursue the joint framework document. I think the fears that have given rise to stories, as I indicated a moment ago, are mistaken fears and I think it will become apparent that they are mistaken fears but if I may push aside the political element that you raise, I have said from the outset of this many times on the record – you will have heard me say it many times, I repeat it again – we will only be successful in bringing peace to Northern Ireland if we can carry with us all the people of Northern Ireland. That is why I am playing this with my hands open and the cards face-out on the table.

    Let me take the framework document since it has now been raised twice. When we have agreed the framework document with the Irish government, that isn’t something that is going to be imposed. The framework document will then be published for everyone to see; it is then for the constitutional parties to examine it, to consult it and to comment on it. It goes into the talks with all the constitutional parties; then, if they approve it, it goes to a referendum of all the people of Northern Ireland so the fear that there is some sort of deal in which joint authority is in some curious fashion going to be enforced over the people of Northern Ireland against their will is not going to happen and cannot happen. We have not got joint authority in the document, the document itself is for consultation; it will have to be approved by the political parties in Northern Ireland and when they have finished with it, it will have to be approved by all the people of Northern Ireland so they have a triple look on their own future and I believe that is the way to carry with this process all the people of Northern Ireland.

    There are ancient differences, feuds, fears that have been in Northern Ireland literally for generations; the only way to still them is for people to look carefully and cautiously at what is happening and decide for themselves that this is the right way to deliver peace.

    You asked whether we would have it by the general election. I can’t promise that. It is not necessarily a speedy process. I think it was – I hope it was – an Irish poet, Yates, who wrote: “Peace comes dropping slow!” and I believe that is right. I think it was the “Lake Isle of Innisfree” and if it wasn’t I will no doubt be told tomorrow! “Peace comes dropping slow.” I believe that is entirely appropriate to the way in which we are developing this question in Northern Ireland.

    Everybody – every sane and sensible person – wishes to see a permanent settlement in Northern Ireland. It cannot be done without patiently and carefully looking at each of the areas that need to be dealt with and trying to place in the right place on the chess-board all the pieces that will comfort the fears of the different groups and people of Northern Ireland. That is what we are trying to do and we will do it openly.

    JOHN CRAIG (DAILY EXPRESS):

    When you spoke to us in the sunshine back in the summer, you told us of your plans to reshuffle your Cabinet. Is the Cabinet you have got now the one that you would hope to lead into the next general election or can we expect some more changes between now and then?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    The next general election may be two-and-a-half years away but I certainly have no plans for changes now. I enjoyed that press conference in the garden; I did contemplate having it in the garden this afternoon but I wasn’t sure how generally popular that might be.

    QUESTION:

    [Inaudible] devolution for quite some time now, indeed since the last general election. Does it surprise you therefore to find in the opinion polls the majority swinging the other way, in the “Sunday Times” poll for example 49% for, 32% against?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think the debate on devolution is only just beginning. Why do I believe so many people favour it? I think instinctively in every part of the United Kingdom people are proud of being Scottish, Welsh, English or Northern Irish and instinctively asked about a Scottish Parliament “Would you like a Scottish Parliament?” I think the answer instinctively is likely to be yes. Asked: “Would you like to pay more income tax than anybody else in the vicinity?” the answer may be no. Asked whether you would wish to see companies disinvest, moving away from Scotland, creating more people unemployed, I think the answer would be no. Asked whether you want to be a little Scotland in the middle of a great European Community without having the negotiating strength of the whole United Kingdom, I think the answer would be no. Asked if you would like to be the United Kingdom equivalent of Quebec in Canada, I think the answer will be no.

    It is not only me, not only the Conservative Party who thinks that these plans are folly. Other people, as they begin to examine them, will see that underneath the general aspiration there are very dangerous and damaging policies indeed. I will spell them out in detail again if you wish but I think you all are aware of the things that concern me: the different taxation policy; the question of the rights of Members of Parliament at Westminster in Scotland; the fact that if there was a Scottish Parliament there would be no justification for the numerically over-large Scottish membership in the House of Commons.

    All those are issues of some importance but if a Scottish Parliament was established and then began to challenge the English Parliament on issues, as I believe would almost undoubtedly be the case over time, what are the difficulties that are going to arise at that stage? What happens if there is a backlash elsewhere in the United Kingdom against the Scottish Parliament? I am not speaking out against the wishes of Scotland, I believe I am speaking for the interests of Scotland in pointing out that what is proposed is not a proposition that will help the living standards of Scotland or the future of Scotland and I will continue to make that point until we have won the debate, won the argument and seen these damaging proposals ditched and gone for ever.

    ROBIN OAKLEY (BBC TV):

    Prime Minister, two of your biggest problems in running your party centre round the disunity on Europe and on the sleaze factor. Why have you moved from saying that the rebels have got to work their way back over months to saying they would be taken back within weeks? What strength will your whips have to exert any discipline in future if they are taken back quickly?

    On the sleaze factor, why are you not encouraging the Nolan Committee to look into the financing of political parties around which many people’s worries on the sleaze factor tend to concentrate?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I don’t think that is the remit of the Nolan Committee, it wasn’t set up to look at that and I don’t anticipate that it is going to look at that.

    On the first point, the question of the colleagues who don’t have the whip, it is up to events to determine when they come back. I indicated over the weekend that I thought on many issues they were very strong Conservatives indeed, they will wish to see a Conservative victory at the next general election. I don’t believe the issues of dispute that have caused this split are issues that it is impossible to resolve. I think some of the resolution is now in place and I think the rest of the resolution is now a clear path so I believe that they will come back. I can’t determine when they come back, it will need an agreement between both of us – as I indicated a moment ago, it takes two to reach such an agreement. I hope that they will decide to do so and I believe that is the wish of the 321 Conservative MPs in the House who have the whip.

    QUESTION (CH4):

    Prime Minister, could you foresee winning the next general election without lowering taxes substantially?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I can’t anticipate the next two budgets. I am in favour of lower taxes but only providing it is economically justifiable; we will have to wait and see whether that is the case. I don’t think it would be prudent for me to tell you now what will be in the next budget or indeed the budget after that.

    QUESTION (DON McINTYRE):

    Prime Minister, do you think that the current well-publicised deliberations of the CBI and others on executive pay are in the end going to result in some form of legislation on that topic?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think they are trying to produce a system where peer pressure works and I believe that is the right way to deal with it. I think peer pressure on executive pay and ensuring that shareholders and institutional shareholders perhaps in particular use their power as the owners of companies to ensure that top pay awards are satisfactory is right.

    The danger is, however ill-advised some of these very large pay increases may have been and however offensive they may have been to many people, once you get in the direction of determining pay for top executives, where do you stop? Do you stop just at the former nationalised industries? Do you look beyond that to other companies that one way or another serve the people? Do you actually look at football managers, editors of newspapers? Where do you stop? You are actually getting into a position where the Government is going to decide who is paid what in areas that are not owned by the Government. That has been tried in the past, it has never in the past been successful.

    I share the concern that many people felt about some of these pay increases and I don’t think anybody who knows me doubts that and I think most of you in this room know that very well but the question is in opposition you can play gesture politics, in government you can’t. In government, you would be asking us: “What are you going to do?” and when we had said: “We are going to do this!” you would have pointed out all the defects in that insofar as it affected other people and you would have been right to do so. Gesture politics is very effective if you are in opposition but it is not effective if your are a government and I think therefore that the tight way to deal with this is the way the CBI are doing, the establishment of the Greenbury Committee. The National Association Of Pension Funds and others have expressed similar views and that sort of peer pressure is the best way to get an effective answer in my judgement.

    QUESTION:

    Prime Minister, you said in your statement that you were going to seek advice from Conservative non-government groups in formulating your policies for the next century. Can you indicate what groups you have in mind and would you welcome members of the public writing in to tell you what they thought?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    They always have done in my recollection. Let me be clear. I certainly didn’t mean the Labour Party and the Liberal Party; I don’t think any advice from them would be likely to be productive. I had in mind people who are non-political, who are specialists in whatever it may be, transport, the environment. I anticipate utilising and inviting some of the specialists in areas of great importance to future Government policy to submit their views on what needs to be done and of course, if people have a particular interest or a particular knowledge we would wish to hear what their views are. We are not just looking at a manifesto for the next general election – let me emphasise that again – we are looking at a much wider and longer time-scale so that we can look at the next phase of development in the United Kingdom and the sort of policies that we think are appropriate both for Great Britain as a country internationally and also for individuals within great Britain and their own individual liberties, choices and opportunities.

    QUESTION:

    [Inaudible] a new strategic authority for Greater London?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    No, I have no plans to do so at the moment, no.

    QUESTION (RADIO COVERING THE NORTH-EAST):

    Could you offer a message of hope for the people in the North-East, particularly the unemployed who feel they have been betrayed by your Government?

    PRIME MINISTER:

    I think unemployment is falling pretty rapidly in many parts of the country, not least of course the North-East. You put the point rather provocatively but I think many of the people in the North-East would look at some of the very large external investments providing jobs in the North-East and they might say to themselves would those investments have come to the United Kingdom and in particular would they have come to the North-East if it hadn’t been for the policies that the Conservative Government had followed and the answer to that question, as you will, know, is no, they would not have come to the United Kingdom and they would not have come to the North-East so I believe when they look at that dispassionately they will see the opportunities for increasing employment.

    What we have seen over the past two years is a continuing reduction in the level of unemployment; it has come down, frankly, faster than we imagined that it would and it is very welcome that it has done so and I hope what we are going to see in the months ahead is a continuing fall in unemployment and to make the reverse point, a continuing rise of the number of people in employment as well. The economy is set fair for that; although there is not a direct relationship between growth and job creation for a number of complex reasons, I hope that is the trend that we are going to see.

    QUESTION (MICHAEL WHITE):

    You are holding this press conference 43.5% behind in the polls, you say the economic recovery is coming through but isn’t it possible that if people feel as confident as you say they will they will take a chance on another government and if they don’t the reason why you are 43.5% behind is that “Daily Telegraph” readers feel all the insecurity which skilled workers – Labour voters – felt ten years ago when your free-market revolution began? Boris’s readers are as nervous as everybody else.

    PRIME MINISTER:

    Is Boris here. Oh there he is!

    You quote Gallup; Mori had a rather different figure which just indicates how volatile the opinion polls are at the moment, I have never been a great advocate of opinion polls on the question of voting at a particular time and that has been true in days when they have been favour to the Conservative Party as well as days when they have been less favourable to the Conservative Party.

    I believe that one can begin to see a great sea change in what has been put in hand over the past three or four years. We put a whole range of things in hand; we have produced a great deal of reform. Reform is often painful, it upsets people, people tend to object very strongly if their particular profession is being reformed; they certainly object very strongly if they face increased taxation they didn’t expect so there are a range of issues why people have had reason to feel disenchanted but because of the decisions that we have taken, because we accepted the unpopularity that went with those decisions, we can now see in the second half of this Parliament – and we are only just entering the second half of this Parliament – that we are on the most secure growth pattern for the economy that we have known for very many years indeed, that the education policies are delivering higher standards, better results, more young people in further education and better information for parents; that the health reforms are producing many more people treated, a wider range of treatments and faster treatment than ever before; and that in a whole series of other Government policies we can see a distinct improvement coming through so I believe the attitude does change. There is a fashion about these things. I think people will begin to see over the months ahead that the circumstances are changed, that many people who feel gloomy will begin to feel perhaps the gloom has been overdone and the prospects for them are much better.

    One of the things I believe affecting many of the people who feel very concerned is insecurity about their own employment prospects – you referred to Boris’s readers, I am sure that would be the case with many of those people –and yet we have seen for two years unemployment falling. In France, the nearest comparable economy to the United Kingdom in size and structure, you have unemployment at 12.8% and rising; here in Britain it is 8.8% and falling. That argues that we must have done something right and I believe as that continues to fall that message is going to echo very clearly in each and every part of the country and I will do my best to ensure that it does, Michael, as I am sure you will.

  • PMQT – 10 January 1995

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 10th January 1995.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Ms Corston: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major): This morning I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Ms Corston: Does the Prime Minister agree that it is totally unacceptable for the Government or for any individual Minister to hide behind Britain’s laudable ban of the veal crate system while turning a blind eye to the annual export of hundreds of thousands of calves, knowing full well that they will spend their short lives in wooden boxes in the dark?

    The Prime Minister: My right hon. Friend the Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food has done more than most people in this country to try to change the laws right across Europe to deal with veal. Both he and I would like to see less trade in live animals and more in carcase form. But, as the hon. Lady will know, there is a long tradition of Agriculture Ministers having farming interests, which they rightly stand back from when they are Agriculture Ministers. What the hon. Lady did not mention was that my right hon. Friend’s farm is managed on a day-to-day basis by a farm management company headed by a Labour Front-Bench spokesman in the House of Lords.

     

    Q2. Mr. David Evans: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Evans: Is my right hon. Friend aware that Conservative Members want to wish him and his family a very happy and prosperous new year? Is it the Conservative party that wants to put VAT on school fees, split up the United Kingdom with devolution plans, or nationalise utilities under clause IV, or is it the lot opposite, led by Bambi, with his 60 quid-a-week haircut, who sends his son to a grant-maintained school when his party want to abolish them? Is there anything more dishonourable than that? I do not think so. [Interruption.]

    The Prime Minister: I can tell, Madam Speaker, that this is going to be an uncontroversial Session of Parliament. My hon. Friend leads us in that direction. Clearly, the policy-making activities of the principal opposition party are running into some difficulties at the moment. I do not think that many people are quite sure who these days is forming Labour policy on education, health, energy and other subjects. The closer one examines Labour policy, the more it falls apart. My hon. Friend should not object to that; he should lie back and enjoy it.

    Mr. Blair: Does the Prime Minister agree that any attempt by the rail regulator under privatisation to cut through-ticketing, with the result that people may have to travel 50 miles to get a train ticket, would be utterly unacceptable, and will he, if necessary, intervene to stop such an attempt?

    The Prime Minister: As the Secretary of State for Transport said the other day, and as I am happy to reaffirm, we have repeatedly made clear our commitment to maintaining through-ticketing.

    Through-ticketing should continue to be available from a wide range of outlets, to meet passengers’ needs. The regulator, like other regulators, is by law independent, but the Secretary of State has powers to give him guidance under the Railways Act 1993. The regulator is bound to take account of such guidance, but at this stage, prior to the issue of a consultation document, the question of guidance is entirely premature.

    Mr. Blair: If the Prime Minister has no power to prevent the regulator from introducing such an arrangement–what he has described is merely guidance–will he undertake that if the regulator makes such proposals he will direct the franchising director not to offer a franchise to any of the 25 companies unless it offers a complete through-ticket service?

    The Prime Minister: As I have told the right hon. Gentleman, I am at least as committed to through-ticketing as he is. He is trying yet again to have it both ways. The Labour party complains routinely that the Government should have more powers over the regulator, but if we had such direct powers it would complain about Government interference, as it did during the rail strike.

    Mr. Blair: I shall tell the Government what we complain of–the railway system being sold off instead of being used as a proper public service. If the Prime Minister cannot guarantee through-ticketing, and if he is prepared to spend hundreds of millions of pounds on a privatisation that people do not want, when the public rightly fear that it will be used to produce the same pay excesses as exist in other privatised utilities, why does he not accept, as this country does, that our party’s campaign to halt the privatisation is right, and that the railways should be retained as a proper integrated public service?

    The Prime Minister: If privatisation is as bad as the right hon. Gentleman says, why will he not commit himself to renationalisation of British Rail? After 50 years of nationalisation, is he really satisfied with the present rail service? Can he name any time at which the service was satisfactory? If not, why does he oppose changes that will make it satisfactory? The Labour party has opposed every privatisation. Let me remind the right hon. Gentleman what Labour said about other privatisations. It said that British Airways would be

    “the pantomime horse of capitalism if it is anything at all”.

    British Airways is the most efficient airline in the world. I have a stack of similar quotations for the right hon. Gentleman, about every privatisation. Privatisation works; we are privatising rail and there will be a better service.

    Mr. Dover: What hope can the Prime Minister give to the oppressed people of Chechnya, in view of the determination of President Dudayev and of the Chechnen people?

    The Prime Minister: I do not think that anyone doubts that a tragedy has been taking place in Chechnya in recent weeks. Chechnya is indisputably part of the Russian Federation, and the long-standing revolt that has taken place there under local leadership has posed serious problems. I share my hon. Friend’s implicit concern about the way in which the problem has been handled in recent weeks and about the bombardment that has led to so many civilian casualties. As with other allies, we have expressed our concerns directly to the Russian Government. Most recently, the Foreign Secretary saw the Russian ambassador this morning.

     

    Q3. Mr. Beith: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the right hon. Gentleman to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Beith: Under this Government, can any Cabinet Minister claim that he is responsible only for the policy of his Department and not for its operational failings, however many there are and however many have been preceded by warnings from those in a position to know that things are going wrong? Is not good government about running things properly? What will happen to Ministers who have proved not to have done that?

    The Prime Minister: The Secretary of State concerned is responsible for the policy of a Department, as my right hon. and learned Friend the Home Secretary made clear in the illustration to which the right hon. Gentleman has referred. Operational matters fall into a different category, as has been the case for many years. The right hon. Gentleman is clearly referring to recent gaol escapes, and he will know that during the past 20 or 30 years there have been a large number of incidents under Governments of both major parties, and also a Government involving the Liberal party. Such incidents have occurred without making necessary the resignation of the appropriate Secretary of State.

     

    Q4. Mr. Cyril D. Townsend: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Townsend: Recalling that neither my right hon. Friend nor myself voted for the Second Reading of the War Crimes Act 1991, and noting that the funding for the special war crimes unit at New Scotland Yard is to be wound up at the end of March, will my right hon. Friend consider drawing stumps on the whole grisly business? It must be perfectly obvious that not a single person will ever be successfully prosecuted under that expensive Act.

    The Prime Minister: It was recognised from the outset that the police investigations into serious crimes which were committed a long time ago would be difficult. I understand that the police investigations will be completed by the end of March this year. The decision therefore on whether or not to prosecute will be made by my right hon. and learned Friend the Attorney-General, who will be advised by the Director of Public Prosecutions. I prefer to await that advice before saying more.

    Mr. Janner: Does the Prime Minister agree that, in the matter of war crimes, we are talking about personal involvement in mass murder? As the House has repeatedly approved the principle in the War Crimes Act, will he confirm that if–but only if–there is sufficient evidence against individuals of complicity in that murder, they will be prosecuted no matter how long they have managed to evade justice?

    The Prime Minister: I think that that was implicit in the answer I gave to my hon. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath (Mr. Townsend) a moment ago, when I made clear that a decision on whether or not to prosecute will not be a political decision. The decision will be made by my right hon. and learned Friend the Attorney-General upon the advice of the Director of Public Prosecutions.

     

    Q5. Mr. Colin Shepherd: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Shepherd: Does my right hon. Friend agree that a full range of educational opportunity is of the utmost importance to the citizens of this country? Is not it clear from the utterances of the past few days that the old, nasty Labour party is waiting to leap out, given half a chance?

    The Prime Minister: I am not altogether sure that it has not already leapt out during the past few days. We have seen the quickest U-turn in history about a tax on school fees, the education spokesman unfortunately not being told what the education policies really are; and Opposition spokesmen in open disagreement about a graduate tax and a range of other totally and utterly vindictive education policies. Those policies will show everyone where the Labour party stands on equality of choice, opportunity and freedom.

     

    Q6. Mr. William O’Brien: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 10 January.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. O’Brien: Is the Prime Minister aware of the concern that has been expressed by many fire service authorities about reductions in their expenditure, which may bring about a danger to property and to life? May I warn him of the situation in West Yorkshire? There has been a £3.2 million cut in expenditure, which could mean a reduction of 116 firefighters in West Yorkshire. Will the Prime Minister take action to ensure that we have continuity of service which will help in the protection of property and life in West Yorkshire in particular, and across the country in general?

    The Prime Minister: Of course the fire service is immensely important. Of course we will make a judgement that we believe will ensure that it can be adequately available to all people who are likely to need it. I am not immediately familiar with the particular circumstances of West Yorkshire. It would be surprising were I to be so. I shall certainly ask my right hon. Friend to look particularly at that in the light of what the hon. Gentleman says.

    Mr. Kynoch: Does my right hon. Friend agree that the proposal for a Scottish Parliament put forward by the Labour party must inevitably lead to higher taxes and costs for businesses, particularly in Scotland? Does he further agree that if that is so, it will inevitably be the first stage on the slippery slope towards the break-up of the United Kingdom–something which the Labour party seems to be intent on achieving?

    The Prime Minister: I fully understand the many people in Scotland and, indeed, in Wales, who believe that a tax-raising assembly may be of assistance to them. I passionately believe, in their interests, that that is a mistaken judgement. I do not believe that the degree of investment that has gone into Scotland and Wales would continue if those investing there had the unique advantage of being more highly taxed than people in other parts of the United Kingdom. I see a great danger of businesses uprooting themselves and moving away from Scotland.

    I have seen no answers yet to the West Lothian question, which the Leader of the Opposition apparently failed to understand when he was asked about it at a press conference yesterday. I have no doubt that the sort of devolution proposed by the Labour party would do immense damage, first to the people of Scotland, secondly to the people of Wales–although they would apparently have a lesser form of devolution–and above all to everyone throughout the United Kingdom.

  • PMQT – 13 December 1994

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 13th December 1994.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mrs. Ewing: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major): This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in this House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mrs. Ewing: Does the Prime Minister believe in the principle of referendums?

    The Prime Minister: I have indicated in the House on several occasions that there may be circumstances in which I would support one. Clearly, in the case of Northern Ireland that is so, for I have already announced one.

     

    Q2. Mr. Patrick Thompson: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Thompson: Bearing in mind reports today of an official survey showing that 11-year-old pupils do not have sufficient command of English to answer questions in science and mathematics, and bearing in mind the mounting evidence of the damage being done by the National Union of Teachers’ boycott of tests, will my right hon. Friend urge Opposition Members with influence on that union to urge it to drop the boycott today?

    The Prime Minister: What my hon. Friend says illustrates the importance of regular testing of pupils and equally regular reporting of the results. I welcome very much the fact that most teachers’ unions have now called off their boycott. It is high time that the NUT did the same, and I hope that it will do so.

    Mr. Blair: On railway privatisation, is it right, as the report to the Transport Select Committee states, that the costs of legal consultancy fees and relocation costs for British Rail alone are now £100 million, and that when underwriting and City fees are added in the total cost may be as much as £700 million? Are those figures right or wrong?

    The Prime Minister: They are certainly not figures that I recognise, but if the right hon. Gentleman wishes to pursue the matter I will give him a more detailed answer.

    Mr. Blair: I believe that the £100 million figure was given in a parliamentary answer. Perhaps the Prime Minister will check that. Is it also right, as the report indicates, that if the privatisation targets are to be met, the rail network will virtually have to be halved or there will be savage reductions in the timetable across the service? Can the Prime Minister guarantee that if there is found to be the remotest possibility of those things happening he will cancel the privatisation?

    The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman is using yet another of the scare stories which have surrounded the privatisation process for some time. Since the start of the rail privatisation process, there has been no shortage of scare stories; that is just the latest one. As recently as 24 November, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Transport stated and restated unequivocally that franchise services would be broadly based on the existing timetable. That remains the position.

    Mr. Blair: The Prime Minister has not given that guarantee. If he proceeds with a privatisation which has no popular support, which will put the future of the railways at risk– [Interruption.]

    Madam Speaker: Order. The hon. Member for Lancaster (Dame E. Kellett -Bowman) should not be barracking from a sedentary position.

    Mr. Blair: If the Prime Minister proceeds with a privatisation that has no popular support, which will put the future of the railways at risk and, in the process, spend hundreds of millions of pounds which should be spent on providing a better public transport service, will that not show how completely out of touch the Government are with the British people?

    The Prime Minister: The right hon. Gentleman is quite wrong. His comments about rail privatisation are precisely the same as the comments that his predecessors made about almost every privatisation that has occurred. Each privatisation has proved a success. The initial costs of past privatisations have been more than outweighed by efficiency and benefits, and that will be the case for rail users as well. The right hon. Gentleman relies on precisely the same scare stories which existed for each privatisation that has occurred. If he seeks further assurance, it will come tomorrow when the franchise director launches the pre-qualification documents. The right hon. Gentleman will then see how wrong he is.

     

    Gibraltar

    Q3. Sir Teddy Taylor: To ask the Prime Minister if he will raise at the next meeting of the European Council the position of Gibraltar within the European Union.

    The Prime Minister: I have no plans to do so.

    Sir Teddy Taylor: As the present appalling restrictions at the Spanish border, with four-hour delays for people and eight-hour delays for vehicles, seem designed to cripple the economy of Gibraltar, and as the European Union seems unable to prevent these illegal blackmail activities, will the Prime Minister give guidance to Ministers to the effect that there should be no further concessions to Spain in the EU until the problem is resolved? Is the Prime Minister aware that it would hearten the loyal people of the rock if he would visit Gibraltar and assure them of the full support not only of the Government but, I hope, of every party in the House of Commons which believes in freedom?

    The Prime Minister: On my hon. Friend’s second point, I can guarantee that we have no intention of deviating from the commitment that we made to the people of Gibraltar in the 1969 constitution. That commitment is there and it will remain. With regard to his first point, we have already made strong protests to the Spanish Government about the secondary checks imposed by the Guardia Civil at the frontier between Gibraltar and Spain. It is very important that the controls should cease and we have made it absolutely clear that the Spanish Government must bring them to an end. They are aware of our views, and we are in contact with them about it.

     

    Engagements

    Q4. Mrs. Ray Michie: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Lady to the reply I gave a few moments ago.

    Mrs. Michie: Can the Prime Minister explain how an assembly for Northern Ireland will strengthen the United Kingdom while a Scottish parliament will apparently weaken it? The situations may be different, but surely the principle is the same.

    The Prime Minister: As the hon. Lady graciously admits, the situation is not just different–it is wholly different. A tax-raising assembly is proposed for Scotland, whereas in Northern Ireland an assembly is proposed which will give Northern Ireland proper control over local government matters. That power already exists in Scotland.

     

    Q5. Mr. Haselhurst: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Haselhurst: Amid all the discussions about the European Union in the long term, does my right hon. Friend agree that there is a practical and urgent agenda to try to ensure that the single market is working fairly and openly, so that British companies have a genuine opportunity to compete successfully in civil aviation, energy and other spheres in which there are currently impediments to competition?

    The Prime Minister: My hon. Friend is entirely right about that and about its importance. At Essen during the weekend it was self-evident that that is an agenda on which Britain is increasingly winning the arguments. There is wide recognition of the fact that the liberalisation of aviation, energy, telecommunications and a range of other areas is vital to Europe’s future competitiveness. A great deal of work needs to be done to ensure that. It must figure very prominently in the Community’s agenda in future, and we will ensure that it does.

    Mrs. Adams: Is the Prime Minister aware of the havoc wrought in the west of Scotland at the weekend by severe flooding in which lives were lost? Is he further aware that the Scottish Office Minister who visited the Paisley area yesterday gave us little comfort? Will the Prime Minister visit the stricken areas and make a statement that adequate funding will be available to reimburse families and local authorities?

    The Prime Minister: I know that the whole House will wish to join me in expressing regret at the loss of life and the very significant damage following the severe flooding in Strathclyde. As the hon. Lady may or may not know, my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary of State for Scotland with responsibility for industry and local government was able to make a statement about the flooding to the Scottish Grand Committee this morning. He said that grant aid from central Government might be available under the Bellwin scheme.

     

    Q6. Mr. Gallie: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Gallie: Has my right hon. Friend seen the “Scottish Engineering Quarterly Review” issued this week, which shows that orders are up, investment is up, recruitment is up and optimism is strong? Is he further aware that today Jetstream Aircraft at Prestwick announced yet another order? Is that not good news in the run-up to Christmas?

    The Prime Minister: I must confess that I have not seen the journal to which my hon. Friend refers, but I will ensure that it is delivered to me regularly in future. I am pleased to hear my hon. Friend’s good news and delighted to hear about Jetstream. A further order will be another welcome endorsement of the success of Scottish manufacturing.

     

    Q7. Mr. McCartney: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. McCartney: The Prime Minister will know that the blood transfusion service is a unique service in the United Kingdom national health service. Last year, the British people gave 2.5 million units of blood freely and saved thousands of lives. Does he appreciate the dismay and disgust at the Bain proposals to privatise the service and close down five regional centres, from Plymouth to Lancaster, with 1,000 job losses? When will the Prime Minister put the national health service before private greed and abandon that proposal?

    The Prime Minister: The hon. Gentleman knows that the NHS is getting more resources and more funding year after year. He also knows that there are areas which can be dealt with in the private sector without harm to patient care and that where that releases resources for patient care it is economically and medically sensible.

    Mr. Yeo: Does my right hon. Friend agree that the results of the past four general elections show that the good sense of the British people can normally be relied on? Against that background, does he further agree that, if the 1996 intergovernmental conference produced substantial changes in the European Union the use of a referendum might be justified, but that in the intervening period speculation about the type of question to be asked is entirely bogus?

    The Prime Minister: In advance of the IGC, it is extremely difficult to know precisely what the question in a referendum might be. I have said that I am not prepared to close the door on the possibility of one, but, equally, that there are important constitutional matters to be considered and it would be very unwise to make snap judgments as to how to deal with that matter. As I understand it, two days after I stated that last week, it suddenly became the Opposition’s position as well.

     

    Q8. Mrs. Helen Jackson: To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 13 December.

    The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mrs. Jackson: According to official figures given to me by the Child Support Agency last week, that body has processed just four claims for compensation in the past 12 months. Will the Prime Minister ensure urgently that the thousands of families who have suffered from the incredible incompetence of that body are fully compensated for their financial and emotional losses?

    The Prime Minister: As the hon. Lady knows, my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Social Security is looking at the child support arrangements. He will be responding to the Select Committee’s report and will make an announcement as soon as the Government have finished their deliberations. Proposals for any changes will be brought forward at that time.

  • PMQT – 21 June 1994

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 21st June 1994.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mr. Robathan : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major) : This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mr. Robathan : Is my right hon. Friend aware of the real concern throughout the country caused by the continuing reduction in our defence capabilities, as illustrated yesterday by the leak about the defence costs study? Can he reassure his hon. Friends that he will never allow the growth of expenditure on social security to undermine our national security?

    The Prime Minister : I can reassure my hon. Friend that the “Front Line First” programme will do nothing to reduce the fighting effectiveness of our armed forces or our ability to undertake defence commitments. I assure him that our commitment to effective front-line forces remains undiminished. The purpose of the “Front Line First” study is to ensure that money spent on defence administration and support is kept to a minimum. That is a sensible aim, and I have no doubt that my hon. Friend will join me in achieving it.

    Mrs. Beckett : Will the Prime Minister confirm that a member of his staff attended a crucial meeting of the Railtrack board last weekend?

    The Prime Minister : A member of my policy unit attended a meeting in Whitehall, at the invitation of the Department of Transport, in order to inform me. The negotiations are between Railtrack and the unions. As the right hon. Lady raises the question, perhaps she will now take the opportunity, at the third time of asking, to condemn the strike.

    Mrs. Beckett rose

    Hon. Members : Answer.

    Mrs. Beckett rose — [Interruption.]

    Madam Speaker : Order. The House will come to order.

    Mrs. Beckett : I think that we can take that answer as a yes, so we now know that the Department of Transport interfered in the negotiations, although it said that it had not, and that the Prime Minister’s office meddled in the negotiations, although it said that it would not. Does not it stand out a mile that the dispute would not be happening if the negotiations had not been sabotaged by the Government?

    The Prime Minister : The right hon. Lady is being ludicrous. The policy unit attends meetings throughout Whitehall, with a watching brief. It takes no part in negotiations that, as the chairman of Railtrack has made clear, are between him and the unions. However much the right hon. Lady tries, she cannot hide the fact that she will not condemn a strike that puts hundreds of thousands of commuters at risk, when hundreds of thousands of other public service workers have settled for pay increases, far below 3 per cent., which can be afforded. As ever, she is the strikers’ friend.

    Mrs. Beckett : What is completely clear is that no one wants this strike– [Interruption.] –except, perhaps, Conservative Members– least of all rail staff and commuters. Is not it crystal clear that it is happening only because the Government interfered? Yet again, the Prime Minister has caused what he now condemns. Yet again, the Government are saying one thing and doing another. Is not that why nobody can believe a word they say?

    The Prime Minister : This has happened because there is an 11 per cent. wage demand which, by implication, the right hon. Lady would accept. Even now, her condemnation is limply to say that nobody wants this strike; she will not condemn it. She would, presumably, end it by meeting the demand. She backs that extra spending. I remind her that last week, she criticised tax increases. A week later, she calls for more public spending. How would she pay for the settlement–by raising taxes, by increasing public expenditure? The hypocrisy in this case rests with the Opposition. The right hon. Lady still will not condemn the strike. To quote her, that is twice she has refused to answer on condemning the strike. Will she now condemn it, yes or no?

     

    Q2. Mrs. Gillan : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mrs. Gillan : Is my right hon. Friend aware that more than 40 per cent. of those recently arrested as part of Operation Bumblebee were on bail? Does not that underline how wise our Government are in the Criminal Justice and Public Order Bill– [Interruption.]

    Madam Speaker : Order. The House must settle down.

    Mrs. Gillan : It will not have escaped the House that the Opposition find law and order so funny. How wise the Government were to crack down on bail bandits in the Criminal Justice and Public Order Bill. As three out of five burglaries are committed by people who are under 21, perhaps the Opposition would care to explain why they oppose policies against juvenile offenders so consistently. Is not that proof that the Labour party is Fagin’s friend?

    The Prime Minister : As my hon. Friend has shown with the figures she has used, there is no doubt that far too many people have been abusing the right to bail. Once the Criminal Justice and Public Order Bill becomes law, a person who is charged with a serious offence committed on bail will lose the right to bail. That is entirely right. If that person is then convicted, the court can reflect the fact that the offence was committed while the person was on bail. Operation Bumblebee has been a huge success. It has shown that by targeting crime, one can bring it down. What is equally encouraging is that the last quarter’s crime figures show crime down by 9 per cent.

    Mr. Ashdown : Does not the atrocity in Loughinisland over the weekend prove that when it comes to evil, there is nothing to chose between the murderers on one side of the sectarian divide in Northern Ireland and the murderers on the other? I remind the Prime Minister, once again, that the gunmen thrive when a political vacuum exists. Will he confirm that he understands the importance, when he meets the Irish Prime Minister in Corfu on Friday, of regaining, again, the initiative for peace through political progress in Northern Ireland?

    The Prime Minister : There is no doubt that the murder of six people in Loughinisland on Saturday evening was a vicious and depraved act of brutality. Whether it is so-called Loyalists murdering Catholics or the IRA murdering Loyalists, it is equally indefensible by any possible measure. The right hon. Gentleman is right to stress the need for political movement and political settlement. I am in constant contact both with the constitutional parties in Northern Ireland and with the Government of the Republic of Ireland. I will certainly discuss the matter further with the Taoiseach when we meet over the weekend.

    Mr. Hicks : Is my right hon. Friend aware that the inherent reticence and tolerance of the people of Devon and Cornwall is becoming increasingly exasperated by the inability or refusal of the Government to do anything to alleviate the growing water charges in the area? Does my right hon. Friend recall that it was 12 months ago that he personally said that he would look at this situation? When can we expect some positive news on that front?

    The Prime Minister : My hon. Friend will be aware that it is for the Director General of the Office of Water Services to determine– [Interruption.] Opposition Members would do well to wait. It is for the Director General of Ofwat to determine the new price limits and he is in the process of doing so. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has published advice on quality matters. That will assist the director general in setting new price limits. We are looking, as I have said, to see what can be done with requirements made under European Community directives to reduce the impact in the west country. We have already found and announced, as my hon. Friend the Member for Cornwall, South-East (Mr. Hicks) should have known, ways in which to hold down the cost of some of the directives. Other ways are still being examined.

     

    Q3. Mr. Nigel Griffiths : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Griffiths : Why does the Prime Minister permit water disconnections in England and Wales, but not in Scotland?

    The Prime Minister : Is the hon. Gentleman asking for water disconnections in Scotland?

     

    Q4. Mr. Cyril D. Townsend : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Townsend : Does my right hon. Friend agree that since “Options for Change” was prepared, the world has become more turbulent and less certain? Bearing in mind the fact that the French, who have roughly similar international defence commitments, have recently agreed to up their defence budget, would my right hon. Friend be prepared to look at the planned defence cut of £1 billion in 1996?

    The Prime Minister : As my hon. Friend will know, in cash, the French spend broadly the same as we do, although, of course, they have a conscript army in France as compared with the professional Army that we have in the United Kingdom. As I said earlier, through the “Front Line First” defence costs study, we aim to maximise the proportion of defence resources allocated to the front line. I believe that that is the right way in which to determine our defence expenditure, unlike the Opposition, who scream “cuts”, but would halve defence expenditure and would, no doubt, if they had the opportunity, also scrap our nuclear capacity.

     

    Q5. Mr. Bill Michie : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Gentleman to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Michie : Is the Prime Minister aware that, next week, on 30 June, a delegation of health workers and friends, supported by Sheffield Members of Parliament, will be protesting about the closure of the Royal Hallamshire hospital accident and emergency unit in Sheffield? As this is a matter of life and death, will the Prime Minister assure the House that he will not wash his hands of that issue, but tell the quangos, which his Government have set up, to stop paying high salaries to bureaucrats and to pay for services for the people?

    The Prime Minister : The hon. Gentleman knows of the increased resources that have gone into services for the people. I do not have to hand the details of the particular case that he has in mind, but I have no doubt that, now he has raised it, my right hon. Friend will examine it.

    Mr. David Howell : Reverting to the horrific killings in Northern Ireland and bearing in mind that there has been some talk lately of a return to internment, does my right hon. Friend recognise, before considering that drastic solution, that there is an opportunity for a concerted and greatly enhanced security drive and for a strengthening of legal and intelligence resources applied against terrorism? If that is done on both sides of the border–in Dublin, and in Belfast and London–we have a chance of beating the terrorism, without which there will be no political solution.

    The Prime Minister : As my right hon. Friend knows, the power of internment remains on the statute book, but would be used only in very special circumstances. Co-operation on security and intelligence matters has improved dramatically over the past few years. It is a matter of constant discussion between the British Government and the Irish Government so that we can ensure that whatever further improvements can be made will be made and precisely for the reasons set out by my right hon. Friend.

     

    Q6. Mr. Welsh : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 21 June.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Welsh : Is the Prime Minister aware that Scottish Tories are revolting? [Hon. Members :– “Hear, hear.”] Led by the Scottish Office Minister responsible for industry, they are scared that percentage levels of VAT on domestic fuel will soon be higher than Tory poll ratings in Scotland. Will the Prime Minister now listen to the voices speaking in his direction? Will the message to the Prime Minister from the revolting Tories meet with any success?

    The Prime Minister : I am not sure that I see it as the hon. Gentleman does. As he is clearly concerned about the position in Scotland, I remind him that the figures that emerged yesterday in Scotland from Locate in Scotland, the inward investment bureau, show that Scotland attracted more inward investment in the last financial year than at any time since 1981. Ninety-five projects are planned, worth almost £600 million creating 7,700 jobs and safeguarding 3,000 others. That has happened under a Conservative Government in this country improving the quality of opportunity for people in Scotland, whatever gloss the hon. Member for Angus, East (Mr. Welsh) may care to put on it.

  • PMQT – 4 November 1993

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 4th November 1993.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mr. Roger Evans : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major) : This morning, I presided at a meeting of the Cabinet and had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mr. Evans : Does my right hon. Friend agree that the appropriate conditions and criteria for adoption policy should be common sense and the interests of children, not the curse of politically correct thinking? Will my right hon. Friend join me in congratulating the Secretary of State for Health on her statement yesterday that makes a clear preference in adoption policy for married couples?

    The Prime Minister : I am certainly happy to congratulate my right hon. Friend on her statement yesterday. I agree with what my hon. Friend has to say about the importance of common sense in adoption policy. There is no place for ideology in adoption ; it is not about social engineering but about providing loving homes for children in need.

    Mr. John Smith : Can the Prime Minister tell us whether, following the discussions in Belfast yesterday and the reported comments by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, there is unlikely to be an early resumption of all-party talks among the constitutional parties in Northern Ireland? After the tragic events of recent days, is not there an inescapable moral obligation on all the constitutional parties in Northern Ireland to co-operate in a new dialogue without hesitation or reservation, and for the Government to make that point clearly and firmly to them all?

    The Prime Minister : I very much hope that it will be possible for the talks to resume, and I shall be meeting the leaders of all the constitutional parties over the next few days. My right hon. and learned Friend and I certainly hope to resume those talks as speedily as possible.

    Mr. John Smith : While I appreciate the importance that was rightly attached to dialogue between the Governments and to a proper response to the initiative taken by the Irish Government recently, will the Prime Minister assure the House that he will take the lead at the earliest opportunity to call together the constitutional parties so that what might be a window of opportunity is not lost?

    The Prime Minister : As I said to the right hon. and learned Gentleman, I am seeing the leaders of the parties individually in the hope that we can map out a suitable ground so that the talks can resume. I very much hope that that will be possible. However, I do not want an artificially staged event where the talks are called together with no probability of making progress. In my private discussions with the leaders of the constitutional parties, I hope that we can find a way through that will enable talks to resume with a practical chance of proper progress.

     

    Q2. Mr. Nigel Evans : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Evans : Did my right hon. Friend see an article on social security fraud in the Daily Express last week, which estimated social security fraud to be somewhere in the region of £5 billion? It mentioned multiple applications using false identities, phantom children and minicab moonlighting. Will my right hon. Friend give an assurance to the House today that he will take whatever action is necessary to stamp out social security fraud, including the use of ID cards for claimants?

    The Prime Minister : Like my hon. Friend, I am attracted to the principle of identity cards to combat social security fraud. Of course, there are some practical and serious issues that need to be resolved, but I assure my hon. Friend that we are examining the matter extremely carefully. We will certainly keep up the pressure on social security fraud. We refer to it as fraud, but in practice it is theft from the taxpayer.

    Mr. Ashdown : The Prime Minister has a justified reputation for his skill as a negotiator– [Interruption.] Does he realise– [Interruption.]

    Madam Speaker : Order. A number of hon. Members are hoping to be called and such interruptions are very time consuming.

    Mr. Ashdown : Does the right hon. Gentleman realise how important it is that he should take personal charge of Britain’s efforts to achieve peace in Northern Ireland? In the light of his remarks a moment ago, is that what he has decided to do?

    The Prime Minister : I am certainly taking a very direct interest, together with my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, in the possibility of moving towards a proper peace in Northern Ireland. By that, I do not just mean a temporary ceasefire. What the people of Northern Ireland need and deserve is a permanent end to the hostilities and movement towards a proper constitutional structure for local government within Northern Ireland. On the question of negotiation, that is rather like poker–it is best to keep one’s hand to oneself for as long as possible.

     

    Q3. Mr. Milligan : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Milligan : Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is hardly surprising that football hooliganism is so prevalent in this country when Labour Members provide the role model that they did during last night’s debate? They used lavatorial antics to divert attention away from some of the real issues that should have been debated–in particular, the future of the railway pension fund.

    Will my right hon. Friend repeat the assurance that railway pensioners will continue to enjoy precisely the same benefits as they have hitherto and that on the one outstanding issue the Government will continue to seek the agreement of the railway trustees and report back to this House before orders introducing the new pension fund are laid?

    The Prime Minister : There were some unusual scenes last night, but perhaps it is best not to dwell on them–not least because I wish to spare the embarrassment of the Opposition Chief Whip and his colleagues.

    On my hon. Friend’s substantive point, the Government remain committed to protecting the security of the pension rights of existing, deferred and future British Rail pensioners affected by our privatisation proposals. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Transport has made that clear on innumerable occasions and I am happy to make it clear yet again this afternoon.

    Mr. Mallon : Will the Prime Minister confirm that the objective of his talks with the Irish Prime Minister, Mr. Reynolds, is to facilitate an agreement among the divided people of Ireland that can command the respect of each sector of that diversity and command the support of everyone within the island of Ireland?

    The Prime Minister : The Taoiseach and I have made clear our view of the direction in which the talks need to go and what needs to be achieved. It is helpful that the principle of consent has now been acknowledged for Northern Ireland. That is vital if progress is to be made. It is a noticeable advance–as, indeed, was the speech of the Tanaiste last week.

     

    Q4. Mr. Duncan : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Duncan : Does my right hon. Friend agree that political correctness, so called, has become a pernicious exercise in social engineering that undermines traditional decencies and codes of conduct? Can he confirm that we are the party of “Mrs”, “Miss” and “Chairman” and that we will have nothing to do with anyone who describes himself as “Chairperson”, “Chairholder” or “Chair”?

    The Prime Minister : In the House we have a Madam Speaker. I believe that that is right.

    Mr. Canavan : Is it true that the Government are now considering another U-turn and introducing a Bill to abolish the House of Lords?

    The Prime Minister : No.

     

    Q5. Mr. John Greenway : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Greenway : Does my hon. Friend agree that in the 10 years since British Telecom became a private company, it has become more efficient, offers greatly improved services and now, under the pressure of competition, is reducing its prices? Is not it a fact that that has been achieved because of privatisation? Does my right hon. Friend share my hope that one day those who opposed the privatisation will admit that they were wrong?

    The Prime Minister : I live in hope, but perhaps not quite as much hope as that. There is no doubt that privatisation has produced better services from BT–prices have fallen dramatically, there are more payphones, in better condition and more speedily repaired when vandalised, and installations are carried out more efficiently. With the solitary exception of the Labour party, everyone recognises the improvements brought about by privatisation. Perhaps that is a little unfair to the Labour party ; I neglected to mention that the Liberal Democrats are another exception.

     

    Q6. Mrs. Adams : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Lady to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mrs. Adams : Does the Prime Minister recall that the last time I asked him a question in Parliament, I asked him to give a guarantee that he would not increase value added tax? The Prime Minister gave me his word that he would not. He has since broken his promise and increased VAT by putting it on domestic fuel, which will undoubtedly cause great hardship to many pensioners and ordinary families. Why did the Prime Minister give me, and the country, his word and then not keep it?

    The Prime Minister : From the innumerable times that this question has been answered, the hon. Lady knows that we will protect people who are vulnerable. She would be well advised to wait until she hears what those protection measures will be.

     

    Q7. Mr. Harry Greenway : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Greenway : Does my right hon. Friend remember the unlamented Greater London council, with its very high taxation on Londoners and its massive and damaging bureaucracy? Has he heard the calls for higher taxation for Londoners, on cinema seats, on videos, on tourists, on businesses, on jobs and on much else? Is he aware that calls for a mark 2 Greater London council, and a large number of taxes in a wide range of areas, are now being made by the ever-loony Labour party?

    The Prime Minister : Over the last few weeks the hon. Member for Dunfermline, East (Mr. Brown), on a national level, has moved the Labour party’s position from no more taxes, to some more taxes, to lots more taxes. It is hardly surprising that in London the Labour party wants more layers of bureaucracy ; it also wants it in the regions, in Scotland and in Wales. It is not the way to produce efficient government, but it is their policy.

     

    Q8. Mr. Tyler : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Member to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Tyler : Does the Prime Minister recall visiting north Cornwall exactly nine months ago to the day and promising my constituents that he would take action to halt the inexorable rise in water and sewage charges– not this year or next year but as soon as he possibly could, and certainly not at the end of the century? How does the right hon. Gentleman reconcile that undertaking with the United Kingdom’s £500 million contribution to the EC cohesion fund, which will be used to clean up the water and sewage problems of Portugal, Greece and Spain?

    The Prime Minister : I begin to suspect that it must be 1 April. The hon. Gentleman should remember his party’s remarks about the cohesion fund at the time that we debated the matter and the moral support that it gave the richer nations of Europe in providing a cohesion fund for the smaller nations. This is yet another example of the Liberals saying one thing in one place and something else in another.

     

    Q9. Mr. Sykes : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 4 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Sykes : Will my right hon. Friend join me in congratulating my right hon. and learned Friend the Home Secretary on his announcement yesterday about sending squatters to gaol if they do not leave the premises in question within a specified time limit?

    The Prime Minister : My right hon. and learned Friend has set out some proposals to deal with that problem, which has been a frustration for many people for far too long. Some time ago, we indicated that we would take firm action to deal with the problem. My right hon. and learned Friend has now set out our proposals.

    Mr. Barron : Will the Prime Minister explain to the House and to the country how his Government got into a shambolic mess yesterday over the railways privatisation Bill? Despite those events, next week and the week after five sitting days will not be used.

    The Prime Minister : I do not know where the hon. Gentleman was last night, but clearly he was not in the real world, in here. The leader of the Labour party speaks fine words about the need to improve standards in public life, but he let some of his colleagues below the Gangway behave in a way that disgraced Parliament.

  • PMQT – 2nd November 1993

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 2nd November 1993.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mr. Hinchliffe : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major) : This morning, I had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mr. Hinchliffe : Is the Prime Minister aware that early next month Mrs. Margaret Humphreys will become the first British citizen outside the royal family to be awarded the prestigious Order of Australia medal for her work in rehabilitating victims of the British child migrants scheme? In recognition of that award, will the Prime Minister set up an independent public inquiry into the operation of the scheme until 1967 and the resulting appalling treatment of vast numbers of British children? In view of his professed commitment to open government, will the Prime Minister end the disgraceful Government cover-up of the issue once and for all?

    The Prime Minister : I am certainly happy to congratulate Mrs. Humphreys on her award. I was not aware that that was the case, but I give her my warmest congratulations. As the hon. Gentleman will know–for I am aware that he has taken a great interest in the matter–the migration schemes to Australia and other countries were run at the time by respected national voluntary bodies. The Government’s concern now is to ensure that former child migrants who want to make contact with their families are able to do so. Any concern about the treatment of the children in another country is essentially a matter for the authorities in that country.

    Dame Jill Knight : In the light of the broadcast by Gerry Adams last week and the offence that it caused to a great number of people, will my right hon. Friend consider whether the arrangements for the broadcasting on our television screens of self-confessed terrorists and supporters of mass murderers should be revised?

    The Prime Minister : Many people felt that the incident to which my hon. Friend refers stretched the present guidelines to the limit and perhaps beyond. That is a matter that perhaps we should examine.

    Mr. John Smith : Does the Prime Minister agree that, while it must be right for both parents to contribute properly to the maintenance of their children, the Child Support Agency is causing widespread anxiety and dismay by imposing a rigid and inflexible financial formula that often ignores the realities of people’s lives? Will he institute an immediate review of the operation of the Child Support Act 1991?

    The Prime Minister : The whole House recognises the need for both parents to contribute to the bringing up of their children–that is not a point of dispute between myself and the right hon. and learned Gentleman. The purpose of the Child Support Agency is to ensure that fathers who desert their children face up to their responsibilities. I know of the concerns that have been raised about that matter and my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Social Security is examining them.

    Mr. John Smith : Will the right hon. Gentleman ensure that, in any examination of the system, account is taken of the fact that the formula appears to disregard a property settlement, which provides a home for children, and also the cost of exercising access? Should not those factors, at the least, be taken into account and will they be encompassed in any further considerations of the operation of the Child Support Act?

    The Prime Minister : There are a number of matters to be considered, including the maintenance formula to which the right hon. and learned Gentleman refers. My right hon. Friend is aware, as I indicated a moment ago, of the concerns that have been raised and he will examine them.

    Mr. John Smith : If further consideration is to be given, will the right hon. Gentleman look into what appears to be another possible fault in the system? Is it right that out of the £530 million that the agency is to raise in its first year, £480 million should go to the Treasury and only £50 million to the benefit of children? While recognising, of course, the legitimate interest of the taxpayer, does not that show a lack of balance in what is supposed to be a Child Support Act?

    The Prime Minister : The right hon. and learned Gentleman knows that the main purpose of the Child Support Agency is to ensure that assistance is given by both parents towards their children. That is the purpose of the agency and that will continue to be its purpose in the future.

    Mr. Lidington : In view of this morning’s press comments about the attitude of Her Majesty’s Government towards possible payments from the European social fund, will my right hon. Friend take the opportunity to make the Government’s position clear?

    The Prime Minister : I have seen suggestions in the press in recent weeks that sums due from the social fund would not be paid. Those reports are misguided. It is my expectation that the £300 million figure that has been mentioned in those press reports will be taken up by authorities within the calendar year.

     

    Q2. Mr. Hoyle : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Hoyle : Is the Prime Minister aware that the imposition of a guillotine on the Railways Bill is an affront to democracy– [Interruption.] –which has caused disquiet not only on Opposition Benches, but on his Benches, too, because it will curtail discussion of vital subjects such as pensions, railcards, and British Rail’s bid for franchises? Does not he realise that it will be seen by the public as a cheap, gerrymandering attempt to get an unpopular measure, which was introduced by his Government, through the House when it could have been debated fully in the two weeks up to the Queen’s Speech?

    The Prime Minister : The hon. Gentleman has been a Member of the House for a long time and I congratulate him on keeping a straight face while he asked that question. When the arrangements for consideration of Lords amendments to the Railways Bill were announced, no one suggested that the two days proposed were insufficient. The majority of the amendments that have been brought from another place are uncontroversial, many of them demonstrate the Government’s positive responses to the points made in the Lords and all aspects of the proposals have been discussed exhaustively at all stages.

    The hon. Gentleman neglected to mention that so far there have been more than 186 hours of debate, including 130 hours in this House alone–hardly a negation of democracy.

     

    Q3. Mr. Brandreth : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Brandreth : May I thank my right hon. Friend for his personal involvement in encouraging the Maryland bank of North America to bring its European headquarters to the city of Chester and with it the prospect of 1,000 new jobs for my constituents? Does my right hon. Friend agree that employment and employment prospects must now go to the top of the European agenda and that the British approach gets the right results–less regulation means more jobs?

    The Prime Minister : My hon. Friend is entirely right about the relationship between regulation and jobs. The greater the extent to which we can reduce both regulation from Brussels and domestic regulation, the greater will be the likelihood of increasing the number of jobs in the United Kingdom. I am delighted at the excellent news from Chester and I congratulate my hon. Friend and my right hon. Friends the Secretary of State for Employment and the Ministry for Industry on their part in obtaining that institution.

    Mr. Galloway : Will the Prime Minister find time today to call for the court reports referred to in early-day motion 2534, standing in my name and that of other hon. Members, on the torture of a British citizen, Sulaiman Al-Adsani, by Sheikh Jabar Al-Sabah, a member of the Kuwaiti royal house? That matter is now to go before the courts in Kuwait. The torture, which consisted of the burning of 25 per cent. of the body of that British citizen and of his being held repeatedly under water in a swimming pool that was floating with dead bodies and being pistol-whipped and brutally beaten, is a serious matter. Given that the Al-Sabah family business was reinstated to power at the point of British arms and at much British sacrifice, does the Prime Minister think that it would be a worthwhile subject of discussion between him and the Government of Kuwait?

    The Prime Minister : My understanding is that the matter is being dealt with by the courts of Kuwait, but in the light of what the hon. Gentleman has said, I shall look at the information available to us.

     

    Q4. Mr. Hawkins : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Hawkins : May I congratulate my right hon. Friend on his desire to get back to basics in education? Does he agree that it is essential to keep A-levels as a beacon of excellence at the top of secondary education, to concentrate on reading and writing in primary schools and to ensure that there is strong discipline in schools?

    The Prime Minister : I want to see us get back to basics in education, as in other subjects. We want to hear a good deal more of common sense and traditional values and rather less of the fashionable views that have so often offended parents and damaged education. I know that many teachers are concerned about the problem of discipline in schools and my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education wishes to discuss with teachers what action can be taken.

    Mr. Stevenson : In view of the collapse of the Government’s policy on law and order, which has led to rocketing crime figures and equally record prison populations, does the Prime Minister agree with Mr. Derek Lewis that a return to that Victorian value, the prison ship, would be regrettable?

    The Prime Minister : There is an internal contradiction in the hon. Gentleman’s question. If he is right and our policy has collapsed, we would not be catching villains and our prisons would not be crowded. He should listen to what the chairman of the Police Federation said just eight days ago :

    “There has been a lot of comment about prison in the last few days One fact is clear. Society must be protected from the small but vociferous minority who put two fingers up to the criminal justice system. They are cautioned or bailed simply to be let out again and to reoffend and reoffend again These criminals should be behind bars. By locking them up they will be unable to ruin other people’s lives.”

    Those are my views as well.

     

    Q6. Sir Peter Tapsell : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Sir Peter Tapsell : May I urge my right hon. Friend to be sceptical about the siren voices predictably suggesting to him and the Chancellor of the Exchequer that a major contribution can be made towards reducing the public sector borrowing requirement by relying on the future growth of our economy? That is the fairy gold school of economics, greatly beloved by Opposition politicians all over the world. Does he agree that it is important that, on Budget day, it should be seen that we are making an immediate, substantial and steady movement towards a reduction of our fiscal deficit?

    The Prime Minister : My hon. Friend is entirely right about the need to make a steady and consistent move to reduce our fiscal deficit. We have been looking at the range of Government expenditure to find out whether it is necessary; if it is, whether it is being spent effectively; and whether there is waste that we can cut. Those are propositions behind which all my right hon. and hon. Friends can unite, in stark contrast to the Opposition, who would throw taxpayers’ money at every problem. There will be a series of ways to reduce the fiscal deficit : withholding public expenditure is one; and growth and other factors will make a contribution.

     

    Q7. Mr. O’Hara : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Tuesday 2 November.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Member to the answer that I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. O’Hara : Yesterday in the House, the Government failed to refute a figure in a Department of Transport working paper of £1.15 billion extra subsidy that would be needed for British Rail after privatisation. That is considerably in excess of the sum that would be raised were VAT imposed on domestic fuel bills at a rate of 8 per cent. next year. Will the Prime Minister apologise to pensioners who will be shivering through next winter when he tells them that they will be contributing to the placing of not one more train on our rail tracks or one more passenger on those trains, but to a semblance of profitability in a sham of privatised railways?

    The Prime Minister : The hon. Gentleman is talking total nonsense, as the House will have expected of him. We have made it clear on a number of occasions that we are looking at assistance to help vulnerable people with their heating costs during the winter. I remind the hon. Gentleman that matters such as special cold weather payments were never raised, provided or thought about by previous Governments.

  • PMQT – 28 October 1993

    Below is the text of Prime Minister’s Question Time from 28th October 1993.


    PRIME MINISTER:

     

    Engagements

    Q1. Mr. Shersby : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister (Mr. John Major) : This morning, I presided at a meeting of the Cabinet and had meetings with ministerial colleagues and others. In addition to my duties in the House, I shall be having further meetings later today.

    Mr. Shersby : As a result of my right hon. Friend’s discussions today, does he agree that the fight against crime calls for a partnership between the Government, the police and the people? Will my right hon. Friend’s Administration do all in their power to raise the morale of the police so that the police can do more effectively the difficult job of protecting the lives and property of every citizen of our country?

    The Prime Minister : I believe that my hon. Friend is quite right to talk about the importance of police morale and the need to form a partnership between the police, the Government and the public in tackling crime. Nothing does police morale or public morale more harm than to see criminals uncaught or unpunished. I give my hon. Friend a complete assurance that crime will remain at the centre of our concerns in the months and years ahead.

    Mr. John Smith : Can the Prime Minister tell us whether it is really the case that, after accepting an amendment that British Rail should be allowed to bid for rail franchises, the Government now intend to table further amendments which will remove that right if there are any other bids? How can the right hon. Gentleman justify such a blatant and discreditable manoeuvre?

    The Prime Minister : The right hon. and learned Gentleman will have to wait and have a look at the amendments which my right hon. Friend will table this afternoon. The right hon. and learned Gentleman would be wise to wait and see.

    Mr. Smith : Will the Prime Minister deal with the clear point of principle? If British Rail put in a bid for a franchise and that was clearly the best offer, why should that be knocked out in favour of a worse offer from a competitor? What is the justification for that in terms of the taxpayer or traveller?

    The Prime Minister : I advised the right hon. and learned Gentleman to wait, and he might have been rather wiser to have done so. The Government accept that there might be circumstances in which it might be appropriate for British Rail to be a franchisee. However, we remain of the view that it would not be right to treat British Rail in the same way as other potential franchisees and that measures for this provision should be made in relation to British Rail’s role in the franchising process.

    Mr. Smith : Is not the Prime Minister revealing that the Government are accepting an amendment and then seeking to nullify it? Instead of those cynical tricks, would not it be better to take this legislation away altogether, because 80 per cent. of the British public know that rail privatisation means higher fares and fewer services? It is a rotten deal for taxpayer and traveller.

    The Prime Minister : It is precisely to produce a better deal for taxpayers and travellers that we are bringing in private sector skills to ensure that British Rail is run more efficiently. The Labour party on this, as on other issues, really needs to make up its mind. The right hon. and learned Gentleman effectively accuses us of making sham concessions. [Interruption.] Yes, oh splendid. In that case, his hon. Friend who speaks for his party said that it was a U-turn. It cannot be both.

     

    Q2. Sir Anthony Durant : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Sir Anthony Durant : My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister will be aware of the two bombs that were put in Reading station last weekend. Will he pass on, through my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Transport, the grateful thanks of the people of Reading for the fact that the railway police, the Army and the railway staff defused that bomb, which would have caused major damage and loss of life? Will he, therefore, as Prime Minister, take tough action against those vicious terrorists?

    The Prime Minister : I am happy to join my hon. Friend in paying tribute to the Army, the police, the emergency services and the staff of British Rail for the magnificent way in which they dealt with the incidents at the weekend. I believe that they deserve the utmost thanks and the terrorists will achieve nothing whatsoever from those crimes of violence. Their readiness to kill and their readiness to inflict injury will merely reinforce the Government’s determination and, I hope, the determination of everyone in the House to ensure that they gain nothing whatsover now or in the future from their actions.

    Mr. Faulds : Does the Prime Minister recall that he gained considerable international kudos when he mounted the initiative to safeguard or to try to safeguard the Kurds in northern Iraq? Now that his Government and other European Governments have so abysmally failed the Bosnian Muslims, would he perhaps restore his credibility, even only fractionally, were he to launch an initiative to try to safeguard the Marsh Arabs–the Shi’ias–in southern Iraq, an issue which the Prince of Wales raised in his admirable speech to the Oxford Centre for Islamic Studies yesterday?

    The Prime Minister : I do not accept for one second the hon. Gentleman’s strictures on helping the Bosnians, in particular the Bosnian Muslims. There is no country in Europe or beyond that has such a proud record of humanitarian assistance over the past two years. It would be more graceful of the hon. Gentleman to acknowledge that fact. I fully share the concerns expressed by His Royal Highness the Prince of Wales about the draining of the marshes in southern Iraq. It is a matter on which the Government have spoken before. We and the Security Council have repeatedly condemned repression of the Shi’ias and have repeatedly demanded full access for the United Nations. That, we believe, is the right way for us to continue in this matter. I give the hon. Gentleman the assurance that we do not regard this as a light matter to be casually pushed aside. We will continue to pursue it in the right way and in the right place, and that is the United Nations.

     

    Q3. Mr. David Atkinson : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Atkinson : Does my right hon. Friend agree that, with social security abuse and fraud costing our constituents many billions of pounds a year, they will welcome the introduction of an identity card scheme, which will do nothing to threaten civil liberty but do much to support and encourage individual freedom and responsibility?

    The Prime Minister : I know that my hon. Friend speaks for many people, and I share whole-heartedly his wish to stamp out social security fraud. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Social Security is looking at a range of options to step up the fight against fraud, and as part of that he is looking at the practicalities of the introduction of an identity card scheme. Frankly, I find the principle of such a scheme to be attractive, but there are many practical difficulties to be overcome.

     

    Q.4 Mr. Austin Mitchell : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer the hon. Gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Mitchell : It looks very much as though the Government are not reducing interest rates because they are covertly shadowing the deutschmark once again. At the same time, other European Governments are saying that Maastricht is not dead, that the exchange rate mechanism should be reconstituted and that the timetable for monetary union can and should be followed. In other words, we are probably in for Europe’s biggest ever outburst of necrophilia. What will the Prime Minister be saying about stage 2 of monetary union and about the burdens, the timetables and the obligations that it imposes?

    The Prime Minister : I commend to the hon. Gentleman an excellent article he may have seen in The Economist not very long ago which set out clearly the way in which the Government will proceed in terms of the future of our policy in Europe. Stage 2 of economic and monetary union involves no infringement whatever of sovereignty over monetary affairs. It is fixed in the international treaty and it is fixed in our legislation. But it does not mean that we proceed to stage 3 and it does not infringe in any way our own monetary sovereignty.

     

    Q5. Sir Peter Tapsell : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Sir Peter Tapsell : May I join its author in congratulating the writer of the article in The Economist on 25 September, which set out clearly and in a masterly fashion the traditional policy of the British Government towards the European Community? May I express to my right hon. Friend the belief that almost the whole of the Conservative parliamentary party and, indeed, the British electorate will be able to unite behind his total rejection in that article of economic and monetary union, a single European currency and a united states of Europe? Will he repeat the points he made in that article in forceful terms to the 11 Heads of Government whom he will meet in Brussels tomorrow?

    The Prime Minister : I rather fancy that the other Heads of Government noticed what I wrote while on holiday in Portugal, which was subsequently printed in The Economist article, so they will be in no doubt about the Government’s position. As appropriate, I will re-endorse it tomorrow and on other occasions.

    Mr. Purchase : The Governor of the Bank of England has made it perfectly clear that he regards zero inflation as the overriding goal of economic policy. Has the Prime Minister made an assessment of the effects of such a policy on unemployment and growth?

    The Prime Minister : I made clear to the House well over three years ago how important I regarded ensuring that we got inflation down to the lowest possible level. No one has ever been in any doubt about the determination of the Government to achieve that. We have achieved it. We have inflation now at a lower level than we have seen for 30-odd years. We have interest rates at a lower level than we have seen for a very long time. They are the essential prerequisites to sustainable growth over the medium and long term.

     

    Q6. Mr. Bates : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Bates : Will my right hon. Friend join me in welcoming the announcement made by Nissan yesterday of a £26 million expansion to its car plant at Sunderland? Does he agree that that investment will further strengthen the manufacturing base of the north-east and that it is a substantial vote of confidence in favour of the work force in Sunderland and in the strength of the British-led economic recovery?

    The Prime Minister : It is certainly a substantial vote of confidence in the work force at Sunderland, and I am absolutely delighted at this increased investment by Nissan. I have to make the point that if we had followed policies that piled on employers social costs such as the minimum wage and the social contract, I strongly suspect that that investment would not have come to this country but would have gone elsewhere.

    Mr. McGrady : In view of the grave political and security problem in Northern Ireland caused mainly by the political vacuum of the past 12 months because the Democratic Unionist party and the Conservative and Unionist party refused to attend the conference table, will the Prime Minister, in union with the Irish Government, reconvene the round table conference of all the democratic parties so that the private documents of the DUP and the official Unionist party, and the document of my hon. Friend the Member for Foyle (Mr. Hume), can be placed on the table? More than that, the distrust and the fears of the people of Northern Ireland can be removed by proper political dialogue and some hope for the future can be given.

    As a writer, will the Prime Minister take note of the statement made in the Dail yesterday by the Tanaiste, Dick Spring, setting out six principles that all fair-minded people would regard as a fair basis of political progress in Ireland as a whole?

    The Prime Minister : It is precisely to ensure that we get a proper political process and the return of constitutional rights to the people of Northern Ireland that my right hon. and learned Friend the Secretary of State has been pursuing with such skill and vigour–as did his predecessor- -the three-stranded approach in Northern Ireland. I saw with great interest the remarks of the Tanaiste yesterday and I hope to have the opportunity of discussing them with the Taoiseach tomorrow.

     

    Q7. Mr. Fabricant : To ask the Prime Minister if he will list his official engagements for Thursday 28 October.

    The Prime Minister : I refer my hon. Friend to the reply that I gave some moments ago.

    Mr. Fabricant : My right hon. Friend will be aware of my love of motor biking. Can he imagine the distress that I felt when some years ago I motor biked across Europe and had to do so on a Yamaha–a Japanese motor bike? Will he join me in congratulating Triumph on producing more motor bikes in the large motor bike league than either Suzuki, BMW or Harley Davidson?

    The Prime Minister : I was delighted to see the success of Triumph and I hope that my hon. friend will soon be again riding a Triumph motor cycle across Europe, and perhaps elsewhere.